Unknown

Unknown:
The measure of this would be in how many proposed solutions came into Byron Preiss Visual Publications

According to the 8/9/83 Chicago Tribune article, “some 700 people wrote to Preiss at his New York office claiming to have located the treasure. None had.”. Two things used to surprise me about this little tidbit. The first is that in the 35 years since the article came out, not one of the 700 (or the countless others who also contacted him, Chicago group excepted) have ever stepped forward on this, or any other forum. The second is that none of the 700 had a solution close enough to get Preiss’ attention, and that’s probably also true for the countless others who contacted him after the Chicago puzzle was solved and the article came out. Let me repeat that. In the first year, when the clues were fresh and the Treasure Grounds were intact, not one of the likely 1,000+ people who contacted Preiss got as close as the Chicago group did. Zero.
I am still surprised by the first thing. I am no longer surprised by the second. At all.

Kalessin

I don’t think this is true; I already gave my own anecdote (which doesn’t prove anything, of course), but Byron Preiss was not unknown. The Secret was not an enormous success like Masquerade was, but there is indication that people were working on the puzzles when the book came out. Just because interest in The Secret went almost completely dormant after about 1988 doesn’t mean that nobody cared and nobody heard of it.

I will give my ” own anecdote (which doesn’t prove anything, of course), I’m glad to know there is indication that people were working on the puzzle when the book came out. but interest did not go “completely dormant after about 1988”. We did try really hard. As a matter of fact, we used thing called a BBS to communicate with each other. There was the well which started in 1985ish, it had several treasure hunting threads. of which The Secret was one. In addtion there were at least 3 other BBS’s I used to message with other hunters, They died out almost immediately in 94/95 when geocities came out. It was only when Geocities came out that I actually got to read the news article about the Chicago find. up to that point it was all hearsay with lots of conflicting information. I know Q4t started prior to 2003 but I think it was then that everybody bailed on Geocities and moved over to q4t, I seem to remember one other place before q4t but I cant remember it (it actually might have been q4t and then it got erased and we had to restart, or whatever that was that was why we moved to q4t. That being said it was late late 2003, that I remember BP actually being talked about as a person, beside just being a name in the back of the book and the “publisher” I think it was Fox who actually started that communications with him and that was the point he became a person instead of a name in the back of the book. I’ve never said BP was unknown, I said he was just an un-important footnote having nothing to do with the clues, at least in the minds of those of us working on it at that time. (we have since learned better.)

Euhirudinea

According to the 8/9/83 Chicago Tribune article, “some 700 people wrote to Preiss at his New York office claiming to have located the treasure. None had.”. Two things used to surprise me about this little tidbit. The first is that in the 35 years since the article came out, not one of the 700 (or the countless others who also contacted him, Chicago group excepted) have ever stepped forward on this, or any other forum. The second is that none of the 700 had a solution close enough to get Preiss’ attention, and that’s probably also true for the countless others who contacted him after the Chicago puzzle was solved and the article came out. Let me repeat that. In the first year, when the clues were fresh and the Treasure Grounds were intact, not one of the likely 1,000+ people who contacted Preiss got as close as the Chicago group did. Zero.
I am still surprised by the first thing. I am no longer surprised by the second. At all.

even if all the numbers were correct, the people were writing to Byron Preiss Visual Publications as a company, not Byron Preiss as a person.

Unknown

Unknown:
even if all the numbers were correct

Unknown

Unknown:
the people were writing to Byron Preiss Visual Publications as a company, not Byron Preiss as a person.

Seven hundred comes straight from the article, so I’m assuming that is what BP told the author when he was interviewed. This was August, when the book had been out for less than a year. I bumped the number up to 1,000 and if anything, I’ll bet my estimate of the number of solutions he received over time is low. Way low.
So what? I’m not making the argument that BP the person was relevant. The idea that determining the location of the NY casque depends on knowing where BP went to High School, or anything else about him for that matter, is ludicrous.

Euhirudinea

So what? I’m not making the argument that BP the person was relevant. The idea that determining the location of the NY casque depends on knowing where BP went to High School, or anything else about him for that matter, is ludicrous.

Damn, once again in 100% agreement.

Unknown

Unknown:
Damn, once again in 100% agreement.

Good. I’ll trade on that goodwill to ask you a simple, direct question Matt. Do you think there is a way to KNOW (that is, with complete certainty) which park in NY contains (contained) the casque, without actually digging it up? A simple yes or no will suffice.

JoshCornell

and therein lies your answer…google the mascot for fort ham high

BP went to Westwood High School, not Fort Hamilton. It has been confirmed. The FH theory doesn’t make sense if he didn’t go there.

Use to be we talked about the puzzle directly, although it is fun to see where rabbit holes connect…as they always seem to do.

Westwood….as in, *Midwood*……?

JoshCornell

yes it does. his going their is not a requirement or pre requisite for the treasure to be there.

I’d agree with Josh; the casque might or might not be there, but the Fort Hamilton theory was around long before someone found the name Byron Preiss on their list of
alumni
.

So if BP didn’t attend school at Fort Hamilton High School (and even if he did), what
confirms
that it’s used as part of the puzzle, as opposed to, say, anything else named Hamilton in New York City: Hamilton Heights, Hamilton House, Hamilton US Customs House, etc etc?

Mister EZ

Westwood….as in, *Midwood*……?

Yes, I got distracted by a movie when I posted. Too many distractions.

Steph53282

Yes, I got distracted by a movie when I posted. Too many distractions.

=]

Kalessin

So if BP didn’t attend school at Fort Hamilton High School (and even if he did), what
confirms
that it’s used as part of the puzzle, as opposed to, say, anything else named Hamilton in New York City: Hamilton Heights, Hamilton House, Hamilton US Customs House, etc etc?

absolutely nothing.

Kalessin

So if BP didn’t attend school at Fort Hamilton High School (and even if he did), what
confirms
that it’s used as part of the puzzle, as opposed to, say, anything else named Hamilton in New York City: Hamilton Heights, Hamilton House, Hamilton US Customs House, etc etc?

Look down
And see simple roots
In rhapsodic man’s soil
It possibly removes reinforcement that Preiss is talking about himself and the area around FHHS, in those lines. (Unless some other connection is found.)

Mister EZ

Look down
And see simple roots
In rhapsodic man’s soil
It possibly removes reinforcement that Preiss is talking about himself and the area around FHHS, in those lines. (Unless some other connection is found.)

That was really never likely as BP never injected himself in either cleveland or Chicago and also no where else was it even suggested, he did
To think he did that in NY was always a stretch.
Seriously until the internet there was really no possible way to even know BP was involved in the book at all
it was all Ted Mann and Sean Kelly- most people had not heard of BP until the 90s.

the clues tell you what to do when you know how to solve them.

maltedfalcon

That was really never likely as BP never injected himself in either cleveland or Chicago and also no where else was it even suggested, he did
To think he did that in NY was always a stretch.
Seriously until the internet there was really no possible way to even know BP was involved in the book at all
it was all Ted Mann and Sean Kelly- most people had not heard of BP until the 90s.

Agreed.

maltedfalcon

Seriously until the internet there was really no possible way to even know BP was involved in the book at all
it was all Ted Mann and Sean Kelly- most people had not heard of BP until the 90s.

There are no credits on the front cover of The Secret, but he’s in the credits inside as Editor and Developer, and on the right-hand title page inside the front cover it says: “A Byron Preiss Book (Bantam rooster logo) Bantam Books.”
His is the first name mentioned in the promo letter from the publisher to bookstores (in the thread here on q4t) as the one who conceived the book. As a multi-artist work with an editor, the book would have been shelved under Byron Preiss, Editor.
While not as famous in the Science Fiction/Fantasy editing/publishing world of the early 80’s asLester Del Rey or Jim Baen, Preiss was known to fantasy readers for co-authoring “Dragonworld” in 1979. I got a copy of Dragonworld for a birthday or holiday around 1979 or 1980 (when I was the right age for it), but my copy is lost in the depths of time and space. I never bought or received a copy of The Secret when it came out.

Kalessin

I never bought or received a copy of The Secret when it came out.

I did and until the 90s when the articles about chicago finally made it out to everybody working on the puzzles, nobody had any clue who BP was. Byron Priess Publishing was equated to Random House or Balantine or Bantam… just a company name- not a real person.

maltedfalcon

I did and until the 90s when the articles about chicago finally made it out to everybody working on the puzzles, nobody had any clue who BP was. Byron Priess Publishing was equated to Random House or Balantine or Bantam… just a company name- not a real person.

Not picking on you but… p224.

Steph53282

BP went to Westwood High School, not Fort Hamilton. It has been confirmed. The FH theory doesn’t make sense if he didn’t go there.

yes it does. his going their is not a requirement or pre requisite for the treasure to be there. not sure where you got that idea from…oh yea…you ASSumed it.

jimerson

Not picking on you but… p224.

Again, I realize what the book said, who wrote the puzzles, and exactly who BP was. I am saying that prior to 1992, (with the exception of the guys who found Chicago)
no one cared, no one thought about him or how in any way he could be involved with the puzzle

maltedfalcon

Again, I realize what the book said, who wrote the puzzles, and exactly who BP was. I am saying that prior to 1992, (with the exception of the guys who found Chicago)
no one cared, no one thought about him or how in any way he could be involved with the puzzle

I don’t think this is true; I already gave my own anecdote (which doesn’t prove anything, of course), but Byron Preiss was not unknown. The Secret was not an enormous success like Masquerade was, but there is indication that people were working on the puzzles when the book came out. Just because interest in The Secret went almost completely dormant after about 1988 doesn’t mean that nobody cared and nobody heard of it.
The measure of this would be in how many proposed solutions came into Byron Preiss Visual Publications, how many calls came in, how many copies of the book sold, how many mentions in media, how often he would have been invited onto panels at science fiction conventions, etc. We generally don’t have access to this data.
Preiss was almost certainly a member of SFWA, the Science Fiction Writers Association (which includes fantasy authors), and conventions were very important in the pre-internet era for marketing books, networking in the business of SF/F publishing, authors pitching to publishers (especially small-press houses like Byron Preiss Visual Publications), meeting the fans, etc.

Another bloviated goose chase.

?
are you kidding me?
you are saying the poster album art didnt influence the nyc painting? cmon.

JoshCornell

?
are you kidding me?
you are saying the poster album art didnt influence the nyc painting? cmon.

I dont think it did

Unknown

Unknown:
I dont think it did

Hey, another thing Matt and I agree on. The poster clearly influenced Image 2 (Charleston), but any similarities between it and Image 12 (NY) are most likely coincidental.

Explain please.

JoshCornell

?
are you kidding me?
you are saying the poster album art didnt influence the nyc painting? cmon.

Yes, explain. I see the lion in the image. Do you? And I’m not talking about her belt, little boy.

Unknown

Unknown:
so short answer to your direct question is no

Thank you.

Kalessin

Preiss was almost certainly a member of SFWA, the Science Fiction Writers Association (which includes fantasy authors), and conventions were very important in the pre-internet era for marketing books, networking in the business of SF/F publishing, authors pitching to publishers (especially small-press houses like Byron Preiss Visual Publications), meeting the fans, etc.

i actually came to this very same conclusion…theres really no need to take mf’s word as gold…

you realize by making such a statement you are saying the puzzles are unsolvable…far from the truth.

cause you have to figure out the park without digging it up…to dig it up…

Unknown

Unknown:
cause you have to figure out the park without digging it up…to dig it up…

Dayum. Someone is on his game today.

Euhirudinea

Good. I’ll trade on that goodwill to ask you a simple, direct question Matt. Do you think there is a way to KNOW (that is, with complete certainty) which park in NY contains (contained) the casque, without actually digging it up? A simple yes or no will suffice.

If there is, I certainly have no idea what it is.
so short answer to your direct question is no
that being said I dont think the NY casque is located in a park
and contrary to most popilar theories
I firmly believe it is on the island of manhattan
but not in battery park
and lastly I believe it is intact and whole.
However i am very very inexpert on this casque
so take anything i say as specious wild ideas

there are clues for the ny puzzle introduced in (probably) all the other puzzles…could you find them?

JoshCornell

there are clues for the ny puzzle introduced in (probably) all the other puzzles…could you find them?

I would say you are correct.

what kind of cat would you say that is?

JoshCornell

what kind of cat would you say that is?

I would say that’s the lion of the 1969 Santana album. although the album cover was basically based on the filmore west poster, the artist was lee conklin or something like that. It’s definitely supposed to be a lion but I always thought the poster looked like a tiger.

http://rockandrollreport.com/wp-content … -800pi.gif

maltedfalcon

I would say that’s the lion of the 1969 Santana album. although the album cover was basically based on the filmore west poster, the artist was lee conklin or something like that. It’s definitely supposed to be a lion but I always thought the poster looked like a tiger.

and therein lies your answer…google the mascot for fort ham high

Still its a lion, not a tiger regardless of what I though BP would have known it as a lion.

he woulda known it looked like a tiger too lol…and the one in nyc painting is def a tiger. so regardless.

JoshCornell

he woulda known it looked like a tiger too lol…and the one in nyc painting is def a tiger. so regardless.

I doubt that most people would know it from the album first. and there it is definitely a lion.
I saw the poster first so I thought tiger til I was corrected by the album…

i can assure you, preiss was reffing the poster in the most primary sense. it takes you to a person…can you figure out who?

JoshCornell

there are clues for the ny puzzle introduced in (probably) all the other puzzles…could you find them?

I could, and?

so do it.

you want it listed or you want me to crop out the visuals?

you do you man, dealers choice…
the most obvious one is in mtl.

I’m in the Bay Area of CA – San Francisco/Oakland/Silicon Valley area.

Unknown

Unknown:
I will be in the Chicago area next week and throughout the holidays, so I can try to take some photos.  It just so happens that I am giving my wife a digital camera for Christmas, and we do have a scanner.

Hello everyone.  I’m back, and it’s very refreshing to see some new people in on the hunt.
I am still catching up on all the new posts (I haven’t visited these boards in months), so hopefully I will have something to add soon.  I have to say that the person who does those close-up highres pictures is a godsend!  Would you be able to do it on some of the other pictures?  For example, I would love to see a close-up of that lion-face in Image 4 — the one with the Centaur on top of the arch.  Thanks in advance!
Did you take the pictures?  I’m sure we would all love to see the site.

author=johann
link=board=Secret#=1071476289&start=0#7
date=12/18/03 at 21:37:21

The flowers on the image are morning glories, which matches the time-month-flower-gem system explained in another thread of this discussion board.  I don’t know of any particular planting of morning glories in Grant Park, so perhaps the appearance of these flowers in the image is just for indication of the flower-gem system (unless I have missed or unknowingly stepped on these flowers while walking around the park).
Someone else in another thread has proposed that the Emerald-Irish theme is connected to the high Irish population in Chicago.

This brings up the interesting and/or frustrating point that the flower/month/gem system may have nothing to do with where the treasure is located.  In the Grant Park picture, the connection of Ireland and Chicago is pretty tenuous.  However, it is possible that this is the only purpose of the system.  So, I see 3 possibilities:
1.  The system is just a red herring, and means nothing.
2.  The country where the faeries are from “suggest” the American city in which their treasures are located.
3.   The system will help us figure out which verse to match with the picture.  For example, each picture gives us a month of the year — this gives us a number (Jan. is 1, Feb. is 2, etc.) — the clocks give us the same number.
If we assume that either the 2nd or 3rd possibility is correct, let’s try and figure it out.  Here is what I believe the concensus is on the matches thus far:
1 — Jan/garnet/carnation — Pic 3 (Armor) — Verse 3 — Engl — Mass?
2 — Feb/amethyst/?? — Pic 10 (Juggler) — Verse ?? — Germ. — ?
3 — Mar/aquamarine/?? — Pic 4 (Centaur) — Verse 6 — Greece — Penn?
4 — Apr/diamond/daisy — Pic 2 (Lion) — Verse ?? — Africa — ?
5 — May/emerald/lilyofvalley — Pic 5 (Grant P) — Verse 12 — Ireland — ?
6 — Jun/pearl/rose — Pic 1 (Dragon) — Verse ?? — China — ?
7 — Jul/ruby/?? — Pic 8 (Desert) — Verse ?? — Arabia  — ?
8 — Aug/peridot/?? — Pic 11 (Ms.Blue) — Verse ?? — Italy — ?
9 — Sep/sapphire/aster — Pic 6 (Rock) — Verse ?? — Spain — Fla?
10 — Oct/opal/?? — Pic 9 (Mr.Hands) — Verse ?? — Lowlands — ?
11 — Nov/topaz/chrysntmm — Pic 12 (Water) — Verse 10 — Russia — NY?
12 — Dec/turquoise/?? — Pic 7 (Clock) — Verse ?? — France — New Orleans
So, we know these matches:
Pic      Verse
3 —— 3
4 —— 6
5 —— 12
12 —– 10
Well, for pics 3,4,5 (increasing by 1), the verse #s double (3,6,12).  Any thoughts?

author=johann
link=board=Secret#=1071476289&start=0#7
date = 12/18/03 at 21:37:21

Perhaps all those living in the US or Canada can report their general locations so that we can focus the hunt on a possible treasure site in physical reach of us.
–Johann

I am in New Jersey, not far from either New York or Philadelphia.  I also have a friend in Philadelphia who is also working on this.  He has visited several sites already.

BTW, one more thing.  My friend from Philly is a skeptic at heart, and he keeps asking this question, to which I don’t have a good answer:
If a treasure casque really was found in Chicago, why don’t we know who that person is, and why hasn’t there been even one objective source reporting the incident?
For my own thoughts:  Why hasn’t this person surfaced somewhere, looking for other treasures?  Why doesn’t Byron Preiss tell us who the person is?  Wouldn’t someone who lives near Chicago have been able to find something on this?
hmmm.

That is a sad skeptical and entirely rational question to pose. I wonder if maybe Chicago was found accidentally and therefore all we know is that it’s not available. But would we know which verse and photo matched to it if the publisher did not release those details?
I hope it’s just a case where the winner wanted to stay private, as some puzzlers do. But I’m open to the skeptical interpretation too.

I reread the article about the found casque, and it does not say when it was found.

Well, I’m attempting to find the original news story itself, but it’s not easy.  Would anyone like to call up Byron Preiss’ office and see if they have a copy of the article?

Egbert, I think it has validity! I have also been bothered by the map in the book on page 10.. It shows the migration paths of the various fair folk; It seems they show a vertical relationship (North to South), but I have not finished looking at it yet. I thought that if I used the celtic folk and the chicago find as middle line perhap the folks who migrated north of the celts, would also be located north of chicago, and visa versa south… Anyone else looked into this aspect?
Also Egbert, with regard to finding the identity of the first casque finder… might I suggest that you contact a librarian in the Chicago area, ask them to research the newpapers for references to the story about the find. Many librarians will do research for you, at no cost. It’s part of what librarians do.
Manley

forest_blight

I really like how this introductory news piece comes right out and mentions the book Treasure Island, which just so happens to be where the To Hesitating Purchaser bit was discovered to fit the opening of Verse 6.

Ha! No, johann, you were very forthcoming with your finds. A true gentleman.

All is good.
I hope someone digs up another soon.

Is there any relationship between the “country” and where the casques are buried?  For example, the “Greek” casque, signified by aquamarine, was buried in the Greek Cultural Garden.  Do you all think there may be a similar m.o. for the rest of the casques  (Don’t know enough about the Chicago find/Grant Park to determine if there was an Irish connection to the spot it was found.)?
-Dan

Unknown

Unknown:
Is there any relationship between the “country” and where the casques are buried?  For example, the “Greek” casque, signified by aquamarine, was buried in the Greek Cultural Garden.  Do you all think there may be a similar m.o. for the rest of the casques  (Don’t know enough about the Chicago find/Grant Park to determine if there was an Irish connection to the spot it was found.)?
-Dan

Unknown

Unknown:
I think this chart is a great help, but have one question of clarification.  Why does Kill Devil (not the other way around) Hill have a question mark by Verse 11?  This link seems relatively firm whereas maybe you meant to put the question mark by the Verse 6?  Also, it probably makes sense to call this location Outer Banks, NC or just North Carolina as the casque could certainly be some distance from the Wright Bros. Memorial (see Verse 11 thread).
Thanks!

A while back, I proposed that very theory — and I think we concluded that there is a connection between the faeries’ countries of origin and the cities where the treasures are buried.  It appears that there are 2 possibilities for each hiding place:  either the hiding place connects with the country (the “Greek” garden of Cleveland) or the city where the treasure is located connects with the country (the Irish population of Chicago, the German immigrants in Milwaukee, the Russian immigrants in NY, the Asian immigrants in SF, etc.).  This could help us in some places, such as Houston, where there should be an Arabian connection — maybe the llamas?
Oh, I agree that verse 11 connects with Kill Devil Hill.  But since this chart is ordered by the months in each Image, I couldn’t figure out another way to express the fact that we don’t know where Kill Devil Hill (tied to verse 11) fits.  So I just put question marks next to the city and the verse.  Please let me know if there is another way you would like to see this chart.
As for using the name of the city, I was hoping that maybe there would be some alphabetical connection that we could see, based on the city or town where the treasure is hidden.  You’re right, it might not be in Kill Devil Hill, but I just left it like that for now.

I think this chart is a great help, but have one question of clarification.  Why does Kill Devil (not the other way around) Hill have a question mark by Verse 11?  This link seems relatively firm whereas maybe you meant to put the question mark by the Verse 6?  Also, it probably makes sense to call this location Outer Banks, NC or just North Carolina as the casque could certainly be some distance from the Wright Bros. Memorial (see Verse 11 thread).
Thanks!

Okay, I think we have enough new stuff for another chart.  We actually have 11 of the 12 sites!  Here is a summary.  I put the cities in alphabetical order, and I put significant numbers in there in case there’s a pattern.
Boston ——— Image ? —– Verse 3 —— ?? month
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month
Kill Devil Hill —— Image 9? — Verse 11 —- 10th month?
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse 7? —- 12th month
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse ? —— 6th month
Florida?? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month
Images 3 (armor) & 10 (juggler) haven’t been matched yet.
Verses 2, 5, 8, & 9 haven’t been matched yet.

Try
abebooks
and
here
.
Mark

Here is an update to what we (think we) know after The Giant Squid successfully linked V2 to New Orleans (and hence to P7). So much for our St. Louis theory!
Image  Verse  City          Month      Country  Stone      Flower          Latitudes  Longitudes
1      7  San Francisco  June      China    Pearl      Rose                37,38    122,123
2  3,6,10  Charleston    April      Africa  Diamond    Daisy              32,33      79,80
3      11  Roanoke        January    England  Garnet      White carnation                    75
4      4  Cleveland      March      Greece  Aquamarine  Daffodil            41,42          81
5      12  Chicago        May        Ireland  Emerald    Lily of the Valley    41      87,88
6      9  St. Augustine  September  Spain    Sapphire    Aster                  82
7      2  New Orleans    December  France  Turquoise  Narcissus              29      90,91
8      1  Houston        July      Arabia  Ruby        Larkspur              30      95,96
9  3,6,10                October    Dutch    Opal        Calendula          46,47
10      8  Milwaukee      February  Germany  Amethyst    Primrose
11  3,6,10                August    Italy    Peridot    Gladiolus          41,42        112
12      5  New York City  November  Russia  Topaz      Chrysanthemum          41          74
Verse  Image  City          Month      Country  Stone      Flower
1      8  Houston        July      Arabia  Ruby        Larkspur
2      7  New Orleans    December  France  Turquoise  Narcissus
3  2,9,11  Boston
4      4  Cleveland      March      Greece  Aquamarine  Daffodil
5      12  New York City  November  Russia  Topaz      Chrysanthemum
6  2,9,11
7      1  San Francisco  June      China    Pearl      Rose
8      10  Milwaukee      February  Germany  Amethyst    Primrose
9      6  St. Augustine  September  Spain    Sapphire    Aster
10  2,9,11
11      3  Roanoke        January    England  Garnet      White carnation
12      5  Chicago        May        Ireland  Emerald    Lily of the Valley

Does anyone know anything about the casque that was found in Grant Park, Chicago? which verse, which picture?

I am in Houston and would be glad to contribute.
wilhouse

I like your immigration theory as well, Egbert–the roving fairies finding new homes is a good structure.

btw, the “immigration port” of Galveston, Texas is right near Houston.

Just a thought: Even though BP told me there is a St. Louis treasure, I am not certain anymore.  I have not been working on St. Louis because I am absolutely stumped on this one.

Good point… does anyone know how the verse 12 was matched to image 5. According to the information Johann gave (Kudos to you!), you would have to determine “M&B” to mean Man and Beast, or perhap have known about the Congress Riot…
Is there something else I’m missing that connects the image and the verse..

Hello all!
I was just doing some reading to see how the clues to the Chicago find went with the verse…
I felt the mention of ‘brush’ was not to mean as in woodsy…but in the context of a brush as in a painters brush… an art institute is located within Grant Park.
I am humbled though by the brain power of you all.!  The one correlation I could make was for one already solved!!!

Unknown

Unknown:
Just a minor correction to Egberts observations.
Picture 9 is about the fairies from the Netherlands. Many Dutch paintings feature checkerboard floors. The opal is the wonderstone of the Dutch fairies. They landed in Manhattan and settled at Wildcat Creek (it does exist!).
The whole picture has an appearance of a Dutch painting.
Also the fairies from Scotland and Ireland are considered one nation.

I am not as sure as you are as to whether it applies to the Netherlands or to Scotland.  Here is the section regarding the opal — which is image 9:
The Opal of the Lowland Gnomes:
A cloud of shining, shifting smoke.
“The Lowlands,” according to a search I did on the internet,can refer to a number of places, including Scotland and the Netherlands:
http://www.lowlands-l.net/
http://www.travelforkids.com/Funtodo/Scotland/lowland_scotland.htm

I have updated the chart, and I will continue to update it as we get more info.

Regarding Chicago, someone actually did find the casque by following the clues.  It was so long ago, but I remember reading the article in  one of the papers, either the Chicago Tribune or the Chicago Sun-Times.  It included his name and even his picture with the casque.  I don’t recall what his name is, and I’m not sure whether or not the papers have an easily accessible and searchable archive.  I would like to reach the guy and get him involved in this discussion board.  I also wonder whether or not he continued the hunt.
I failed to take pictures of the site, but I will be up in Chicago in two weeks (in St. Louis now).  I’m afraid I will be going up there for a “flash” in-and-out weekend, but perhaps I can find some way to sneak away with a camera.
The contemplation of a possible system to picture-verse matching is worth trying, as long as we have the valuable skeptics keep our enthusiasm in check.
–Johann

FB,  I’ve been reading all of these threads going back to the beginning, and I just can’t find alot of the things that I remember reading. Especially what the month,flower, clock and so on have in common.  I’ve read Egbert’s posts on locations and verse match-ups and I’m still baffled, eg. what does the X mean in image nine?  What does month, flower, and jewel have to do with image 4 in Cleveland? If you can take a little time, please explain it to me like I’m a 2 year old.  I feel like that because I’ve read so many things on line and in books that up has become down. Help. Por favor!

egbert, can you switch the chart, so that they are listed by monthe.  I think the stones in each picture represent a month’s birthstone (obviously), but maybe by re-sorting a pattern may appear.
Ps.  Saw the article in the Bergen Record.  Congrats.
Unknown

Well
I
spent a successful morning at UNC’s library. In the space of 40 minutes, I found not only an early article on
The Secret
, but also the elusive Chicago Tribune article announcing the discovery of the first casque. I will post the latter on the Image 5 thread. Following are three scans from the Nov. 16, 1982 Chicago Tribune.

Skim through this thread and see what has been posted regarding the Chicago find.  Happy post-hunting.  I only wish there was a treasure still there for you.

The Chicago site has not changed much at all.  It is pretty much the same.

Well, if there’s a treasure in Canada, we now have 13 locations.  So, something is wrong.  Here is the chart of what we know, and what we don’t know:
Boston ——— Image ? —– Verse 3 —— ?? month
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month
Kill Devil Hill —— Image ? —- Verse 11 —– ?? month
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse 7? —- 12th month
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse ? —— 6th month
Florida?? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month
Unmatched:
Images 3 (armor), 9 (funny man) & 10 (juggler).
Verses 2, 5, 6, 8, & 9
Locations:  St. Louis & Canada
So, if 2 treasures are in St. Louis & Canada, then one of the locations in the chart is incorrect.  The most tenuous ones appear to be Florida, Boston, San Francisco, and Salt Lake City.
Thoughts?

Unknown

Unknown:
From :
thanks! yes, there is a treasure in Canada.

Well then–that’s good enough for me.  🙂

another Doubting Thomas speaking up here.  Did anyone ever get a copy of that email where the publisher confirms the location of St. Louis?
BTW, I have a friend who lives in the French Quarter of New Orleans, and she is having a look at the verses to see if anything pops out as familiar.

Thanks Fox.
That is about the fastest maps yet on the internet!
Sorry I haven’t been around for several months. Got laid off from my job of 23 years in NY this past December 04.
Been a trying time with finding a job, with this topsie turvvy telelcommunications field this past year.
Sorry I haven’t had any reall good input into this Treasure Hunt. I dearly wish and pray you all find another casque!
Good hunting!
KRO-magnum

Yeah, thanks Fox. That’s the best.  You can switch back and forth between map and satellite anywhere.

I am officially joining the hunt for The Secret after a short delay of 23 years
..not exactly sure how I missed this way back in 1982 but I did. Better late than never methinks!
However, I am having a heck of a time finding the book. Can anyone assist with this? Is there a known site that has the book at reasonable cost? I did find some selling it for near 50 bucks, but Im not wanting to pay that much for it.
Thanks in advance, Smack

Whenever I’m looking for a hard-to-find book,
bookfinder.com
is the first place I look. It is the “dogpile.com” of online book vendors. They currently have several copies listed, ranging from $20 to $50. Search for (title) “The Secret: A Treasure Hunt” or (title) “The Secret” and (author) “Preiss.”

Use “Sean Kelly” as the author (using “Preiss” may not work).  For instance, Better World Books is currently showing a copy at about $30.

Forgive me Johann et al for being a tad confused here.  The ideas for P9 and S.L. are quite interesting indeed….but…  The confusing part is this:  The main reason we began looking about the gateway city was because of the Jewel Box.  Wasnt the “pandora’s box” in P11 what got us onto this line of thinking?…or was it the line in a V stating “jewels abound”?  Sorry for being out of the loop….

I think it makes a lot of sense for New York to correspond to the Dutch fairies (well, “lowlands,” but lowlands is the literal meaning of Netherlands/Nederlands).  I don’t know if this has been mentioned, but New York was originally called New Amsterdam, and had a strong Dutch presence once upon a time.  Harlem, for instance, is named after the Dutch town of Haarlem.

Regarding who has found the Chicago casque….. your right we don’t know who found it, it may have been found by mistake, or it may have been found on purpose…. It has been 20 years since the book was published, someone may have said “hey, we better let people know these are still out there!” So they dig up one caques release tidbits of information to the press, and the search goes on!

Just since we haven’t played “Competing Tables” for awhile, here’s my current version:
San Francisco—-Image 1—Verse
—China
Charleston——-Image 2—Verse 6—–Africa
Kill Devil Hill——Image 3—Verse 11—-England
Cleveland——–Image 4—Verse 4—–Greece
Chicago———-Image 5—Verse 12—-Italy
St. Augustine—-Image 6—Verse 9——Iberia
New Orleans—–Image 7—Verse
—-France
Houston———-Image 8—Verse 1——Arabia
New York——–Image 9—Verse 5 —-Netherlands
Milwaukee——-Image 10—Verse 8—–Germany
Boston———–Image 11—Verse 3—–Ireland
Vancouver——-Image 12—Verse 10 —Russia
Unsure: Verses 2 and 7
It’s interesting that (in my view) we’re down to San Francisco and New Orleans for the undetermined Verses, and that both cities have significant Twain (V7) connections.  Anyway, argue away.
Pine

I like PT’s summation.  If I may, I would reassign Ireland to the Chicago find P5 V12, instead of Italy.  The stone is emerald brought by the  Celtic folk.  Although Boston is a good choice for Ireland, the Chicago find is a done deal and who can forget the green rivers they’ll have there on St Patty’s day.  Right now, I think Italy is homeless–could that be Boston??

Oh—one more thing–We should be cautious in thinking about strictly major immigration centers in trying to assign the Fair Folk’s country of origin.  That is, where into the U.S. did the irish, germans, spanish, russians, etc…  mostly immigrate to.  For the most part, the pattern does seem to fit.  Examples would be San Fransisco and Chinese,  St. Augustine and Spanish, and others.  This seems intuitive.  But I’m from the Cleveland area and I would not have put Greeks and Cleveland together,  but they obviously were matched.  Cleveland was a city with the largest Slovenian immigrant population as their major in coming group.  I just think that some of the match ups could be slightly looser connections than we think.

I uploaded that one rhino pic here:
http://catwood.leftbrained.org/TheSecre … c00059.jpg
It’s not a high-bandwidth server.

a couple of comments on image 8:
pole with rhino on top looks suspiciously like Dsc00059.jpg in
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/arm … rmannPark/
that I posted.
also, note in trees clear 30, N 95, Houston Lat/long.
finally, note in background 4 posts or pillars, which might be the “four alike” in verse 1.
I agree these are not solid leads.

I think I missed something–how do we know there is only one in Canada?

You are quite right that the pic 11 Pandora’s Box first had us exploring St. Louis, but at some point (or over some time) opinions changed.  I began with pic 11 and verse 2, then left verse 2 for too many other verses, then juggled between a few possible pics and verses, then somehow came back to verse 2 and finally pic 9.  In short, I was (and perhaps presently am) confused.  Your concern is valid.

I am in St. Louis, and I often travel to Chicago.
–Johann

don’t you need the flower and gem and time to match the poem to the picture?

So after re-reading Johann’s explaination of the Chicago find… I propose that there is no particular meaning to the month, flower, gem themes of the images???? perhaps these are themes, but don’t neccessarily have meaning.

Oops, as fox pointed out literally years ago, the relevant “10” in P9 is the Roman numeral X, not the number of petals on the flower. The revised list:
P1
: clock (6)
P2
: clock (4)
P3
: clock (1)
P4
: triangle (3)
P5
: number of warts (5)
P6
: number of asters (9)
P7
: clock (12)
P8
: number of columns (7)
P9
: Roman numeral X (10)
P10
: number of red balls (2)
P11
: number of gold squares in the hoop under the big globe (8 )
P12
: clock (11)

Wow, no one has posted on this thread for a long time; but I did not know where else to post this.
Perhaps we should do more work regarding the Canada treasure so that we can assist our process of elimination in an attempt to pin down the pictures (cities) conclusively.
This post might be a “well, no kidding” post.  Yet, we have not made much of an effort on Canada.  It seems to be on the burner behind the back burner.
–Johann

i think trying to find something in canada is alot harder then finding something in the states because the states in canada are alot bigger and diverse then the states

I’m with you johann.  As a matter of fact, just the other night, I spent about 2 hours looking at buildings/images from different Canadian cities found on the good city link posted on the Resources thread.  Didnt find anything very useful however.  I did find an interesting statue outside of the legislature bldg in Winnipeg (i think).  On the back of the statue, there appears to be an image of what looks kind of like a person with outstretched arms (the armor P?).  I emailed a University in Winnipeg about what exactly is on the statue and am awaiting word….not holding my breath though  :-X

if you really need info about Winnipeg, I know several people who live there.
However, my intuition tells me that the Canadian treasure will be in a port city, somewhere with a history of real immigrants.  (Even Cleveland has a port on the Great Lakes, and Salt Lake City is the ultimate story of emigrants establishing a new home.)  I’ve been concentrating on Victoria, BC and Toronto, ON so far, looking at Montreal next.

ahh, good idea Cat.  Do you then suppose that the US casques will either be located in port cities or at least cities with a history of immigration?  Hmmm, Chicago? (check),  Cleveland? (check),  SF? (check),  N.O.? (check), Houston? (check), 4corners?  😉 (umm, nope) lol.
See if you can have one of your friends check and take photos of the statue located in a small park surround by traffic near the Winnipeg legislature.  Dont know if this link will work but here it is
http://www.emporis.com/en/il/im/?id=208789

I like this game. Here is the worksheet I’ve been keeping. Give me a holler if you want the Excel version.
Image     Verse     City           Month     Country   Stone      Flower          Latitudes    Longitudes
1         7     San Francisco  June      China     Pearl      Rose                37,38       122,123
2  2,3,6,10     Charleston     April     Africa    Diamond    Daisy               32,33         79,80
3        11     Roanoke        January   England   Garnet     White carnation                      75
4         4     Cleveland      March     Greece    Aquamarine Daffodil            41,42            81
5        12     Chicago        May       Ireland   Emerald    Lily of the Valley     41         87,88
6         9     St. Augustine  September Spain     Sapphire   Aster                                82
7  2,3,6,10     New Orleans    December  France    Turquoise  Narcissus              29         90,91
8         1     Houston        July      Arabia    Ruby       Larkspur               30         95,96
9  2,3,6,10                    October   Dutch     Opal       Calendula           46,47
10         8     Milwaukee      February  Germany   Amethyst   Primrose
11  2,3,6,10                    August    Italy     Peridot    Gladiolus           41,42           112
12         5     New York City  November  Russia    Topaz      Chrysanthemum          41            74
Verse     Image     City           Month     Country   Stone      Flower
1         8     Houston        July      Arabia    Ruby       Larkspur
2  2,7,9,11
3  2,7,9,11     Boston?
4         4     Cleveland      March     Greece    Aquamarine Daffodil
5        12     New York City  November  Russia    Topaz      Chrysanthemum
6  2,7,9,11
7         1     San Francisco  June      China     Pearl      Rose
8        10     Milwaukee      February  Germany   Amethyst   Primrose
9         6     St. Augustine  September Spain     Sapphire   Aster
10  2,7,9,11
11         3     Roanoke        January   England   Garnet     White carnation
12         5     Chicago        May       Ireland   Emerald    Lily of the Valley

hey Dan, some time ago, we found a current article in some magazine (dont remember title) which was posted somewhere amongst these threads (cant find where) that stated that 1 was in Canada.
hope that kind of helps  ???

yeah, i was kinda wondering whether it was worded as “at least one” (could be more) as opposed to “1 of the 12”.
By my own inventory, I think image 11 is the only one without longitude/latitude numbers, or at least the only one not warmly claimed by a USA city.

Ok Dan, a copy of the actual article can be found here:
http://www.armchair-treasure-hunt.com/c … secret.htm
it does not specifically state only 1 is in Canada but I remember it was only 1.  Maybe it was conveyed to me by BP via email.  Let me check my archived messages and see if I can find it….    8)

Ok, here is the very brief response from BP.  Shortly after hearing of the article mentioning Canada, I dropped BP a short email inquiring about treasures in Canada…..look at his response.  “a treasure”.   Hope this helps…..
From :
Sent :  Monday, April 7, 2003 2:08 PM
To :  rbfox@hotmail.com
Subject :  Re: “The Secret”
|  |  |  The Secret | Inbox
thanks! yes, there is a treasure in Canada.

also, if anyone is questioning whether the jewels are still available (I’m sure Egg will tell us soon) here is another email straight from the BP’s mouth re: the jewels
From :
Sent :  Tuesday, April 8, 2003 8:20 AM
To :  rbfox@hotmail.com
Subject :  Re: “The Secret”
|  |  |  The Secret | Inbox
In a message dated 4/8/2003 3:44:26 AM Eastern Standard Time,
rbfox@hotmail.com
writes:
I hate to bother you again but you seem to have avoided the
question as to the status of the jewels availability.  Dont worry, if you
say they are no longer available, I will still wrack my brain over this book
until at least one of the riddles is solved.  Thanks again for your time and
such a wonderful adventure.
jewels still available!

sorry to pull this thread up to the top folks but I didnt know where else to put this.
google has a new mapping service that allows not only maps but aerial views of the city you want.  I think an actual photo of a city may come in handy…. here it is
http://maps.google.com

I just heard abou the book recently and searched around online to find a copy.
Finally
, I came up with Albiris books,
www.albiris.com 
It took me a while to search the all the books listed with the words “The Secret” in the title but I finally found it.  In retrospect, I found it was much easier to search by the books ISBN which is 0553014080.  That should make it a little easier to get your copy.  Good Luck !

Wow! Very impressive! Johann, I will assume you live in chicago, I have often thought that certain details (like the fence) would stick out for those firmiliar with a the areas. Is that how you traced what you have here?
I am in Southern California, I have just started looking thru the verses again, I was hoping to find some references to my local, so I could do some physical tracking…..

I will be in the Chicago area next week and throughout the holidays, so I can try to take some photos.  It just so happens that I am giving my wife a digital camera for Christmas, and we do have a scanner.
The flowers on the image are morning glories, which matches the time-month-flower-gem system explained in another thread of this discussion board.  I don’t know of any particular planting of morning glories in Grant Park, so perhaps the appearance of these flowers in the image is just for indication of the flower-gem system (unless I have missed or unknowingly stepped on these flowers while walking around the park).
Someone else in another thread has proposed that the Emerald-Irish theme is connected to the high Irish population in Chicago.
Perhaps all those living in the US or Canada can report their general locations so that we can focus the hunt on a possible treasure site in physical reach of us.
–Johann
–Johann

Johann,
Is there relevence to the Emerald (green Gem) in the picture. Nothing pops out at me. Also the flower on the man’s collar, It’s not the state flower… Is there a different meaning?
Thanks,

Johann,
Thanks Thats Great!
I was wondering if anybody who lives in Chicago could go take a picture of the area where the casque was buried, so we could see what its like.
maltedfalcon

Johann, THANK YOU…knowing the methodology of one puzzle is always useful in figuring out the others! This will offer huge insight.

Well, that’s what I get for not doing a complete Google search!  That certainly looks like the place in Image 12.  Let’s see if we can find more pics!

Well, Egbert asked us to kick this around, so please hear me out on all the highly unconventional stuff I’m about to say…
Within the text you have the keys.  Holy cow friends, how did we miss it?  Stercox and the St. Augustine discovery blew it all open for me.  I believe the arrangement looks like this:
San Francisco—-Image 1—Verse
—China
Charleston——-Image 2—Verse 6—–Africa
Kill Devil Hill——Image 3—Verse 11—-England
Cleveland——–Image 4—Verse 4—–Greece
Chicago———-Image 5—Verse 12—-Italy
St. Augustine—-Image 6—Verse 9——Iberia
New Orleans—–Image 7—Verse
—-France
Houston———Image 8—Verse 1——Arabia
New York——–Image 9—Verse
—-Lowlands
Milwaukee——-Image 10—Verse 8—–Germany
Boston———-Image 11—Verse 3—–Ireland
Vancouver——-Image 12—Verse
—Russia
Unsure: Verses 2, 5, 7, 10
I’ll start with textual references:
– End of p13 and beginning of p14 start to point the Lowlanders toward NY.
– p22 relates the Iberians and the Timuca/Calusa tribes in FL, as stercox pointed out.
– p23 connects the British with (among others) Catawba and Cherokee in NC.
– p23 sends the Arabians toward the SW (Houston).
– p24 mentions Vancouver.
– p29 says “…the leprechauns of Erin…were doubtless in Massachusetts…”
– p29 places the Lowlanders on Manhattan island
– p30 places the Iberians in Florida at the Fountain of Youth
Other arguments:
– I believe Chicago was Italian and Boston Irish.  Both could go either way from an immigration standpoint, but the jewels look better to me this way, and the p29 deal is the closer.
– I believe Image 11 is clearly Boston.  It has the lat/lon numbers and the Irish jewel.  Further explanation is in an old post on the Image 11 page, if I remember correctly.
– Think about actual immigration patterns.  The best place for the Dutch has to be NY, and p29 really seems to cinch it.
– Vancouver might be a stretch, but think about the only area of North America that Russia ever tried to colonize.  It was Alaska and the Pacific Northwest, so I went looking for mentions of cities there.  The Vancouver mention in the text is quite deliberate.  I think this is our Canadian casque.
Now all this is just my opinion, and I know I changed the format of the table, but fire away.
Pine

I LIKE IT!!  I think that there is a lot of information to be gained from the first part of the book, including the margin pictures, many of the sketches match up with the pictures, with subtle detail changes.

I think this is the best collection we’ve had since I started on this hunt for ernest almost a year and half ago (not to mention 22 years ago…). This makes sense, though we need to reconcile the boston image as there was a bit of work done on it.
I know Preiss has said that you don’t need the other parts of the book to solve the puzzles, but the picture of the train, with a number 82 on it, and a big H on the page makes me think there can’t be NO relationship.
wilhouse

wilhouse,
it’s certainly very nice of you to do all of this for ernest.  who is he?
Pine

all right.
earnest.
-1 for spelling
wilhouse
hey, my 400th useless post…

Well, nobody even laughed at my recent “x marks the spot” joke over on the Image 6 thread, so I figgered I’d try again.
Just in a good mood over the Vancouver/New York deal.
Pine

Oops, getting late.
Meant to describe that as my “what-I-thought-you-posted-as-an-x-marks-the-spot-joke-but-then-realized-you-mig
ht-have-been-serious-and-and-tried-in-vain-to-continue-it” joke.
No more humor from now very serious Tree.
Going to bed.

Pine – didn’t Johann say he had confirmation from BP that one was buried in St Louis? If that is true then it would leave Milwaukee and New York as the most likely candidates for replacement. Although I like the links to Milwaukee in the verse and image, and NY seems like such an important immigration center I can’t imagine it not being included. Quick, everyone look for the MYLMLVR!! (j/k..)

I don’t remember whether BP had specifically confirmed St. Louis or not.  I’ll try to look around for an answer, but others may remember more than I.

Unknown

Unknown:
…and since everyone likes Image 3 and Boston, I stuck Kill Devil Hills in the remaining spot.

Unknown

Unknown:
– I believe Image 11 is clearly Boston.  It has the lat/lon numbers and the Irish jewel.

I am one of the naysayers on this point.  I think Image 3 definitely holds the outline of Roanoake Island moreso than the Boston park as offered.
I might be seeing things differently on this point as well.  Image 11 holds the Italian gem peridot, not Irish; the numbers  I see in this image are 111/112 longitude and 41/42 latitude, putting it in Salt Lake City.
I’m leaning towards matching verse 5 with New Orleans, mostly because of the “arc of lights” line.
I feel a renewed need to spend some time with Google Image Search today…

Unknown

Unknown:
I feel a renewed need to spend some time with Google Image Search today…

Nice to have you back and active, Cat!
Pine Tree, I really like those ideas.  The North Carolina and Image 3 do seem to match, just as Cat says.  My buddy Siskel had pointed out to me in the past that the suit of armor with its arms out certainly seems like it is flying (ala Wright Bros.).
BTW, there are no onion-domed churches in Vancouver.
However, I do like the table suggested because all of the cities are either immigration coastal ports or near those ports.  Salt Lake City still bugs me as well, but it is not a port city, so maybe we are reading the 112 incorrectly.

http://www.holyres.org/

Gurya,
As I said in my PM to you….welcome aboard.  We cant wait to hear some new ideas.  You never know, you may just be the one who holds the piece of the puzzle we all have missed.

Unknown

Unknown:
Okay, here is the latest summary, with the addition of the countries from where the fairies originate:
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse 7? —- 12th month — France
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse ? —— 6th month — China
The most tenuous ones appear to be Florida and Salt Lake City.

Im pretty sure verse 7 goes with SF and image 1 –
and the map of florida in the picture almost makes it definite especially now that weve seen the clevland treasure had an ohio map in it.

Will do, MF.  Here’s an update:
Boston ——— Image ? —– Verse 3 —— ?? month
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Kill Devil Hill —— Image ? —- Verse 11 —– ?? month
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse ? —– 12th month — France
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month — Italy
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse 7? —– 6th month — China
Florida?? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month — Spain
Unmatched:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 9 (funny man)(Dutch)
Image 10 (juggler)(Germany)
Verses 2, 5, 6, 8, & 9
Locations:  St. Louis & Canada

Will do, MF.  Here’s an update:
Boston ——— Image ? —– Verse 3 —— ?? month
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Kill Devil Hill —— Image ? —- Verse 11 —– ?? month
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse ? —– 12th month — France
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month — Italy
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse 7? —– 6th month — China
Florida?? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month — Spain
Unmatched:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 9 (funny man)(Dutch)
Image 10 (juggler)(Germany)
Verses 2, 5, 6, 8, & 9
Locations:  St. Louis &
Canada

Egbert–  Thanks.  Part of my confusion came from the color of the stones in both online and book pics.  I was concerned about being exact because . . . (see below message to dan)
dan–  Yes, I have been considering the history of the heavily German population of immigrants and how that relates to St. Louis.  There are also neighborhoods associated with the Irish (Dogtown) and the Italians (The Hill).  The tricky part is the Irish cane among the juggled objects in the pic.  Yet, these neighborhoods are bordering each other.  The most tricky part is finding things that actually match specifics in the pic.
I have checked nearly every neighborhood in the city.  But, tomorrow I am going somewhere I have not been before.
When (if) I find something substantial, I’ll report on the appropriate threads.
Thanks for help, Egbert and dan.
–Johann

It would be intresting to know if the site where the Chicago casque was found looks substantially the way it did when BP buried the casque in 1982.  I guess what I am asking myself is did BP choose twelve sites that were not likely to change much with the passage of time?  Reading the
Plain Dealer
magizine supplement on Egbert’s Cleveland find would suggest otherwise. In the article BP states that he thought all the casques would be found within a month, and that he thought the hunt would be too easy.  Thus, he might not have chosen the sites with the idea that the casques would go unfound and unclaimed for decades. In other words,the sites may have been chosen for reasons other than the longevity factor. From all I’ve read about the Cleveland find, it does appear that the site has not changed much since the casque was buried.  So what about the Chicago site?  And what about the ten other locations?  What I am getting at is that it makes a big difference whether BP chose to bury the casques in places that were not likely to change much over time, or in places like the Outer Banks of North Carolina, a possible casque location, that have changed substantially over the past 23 years.

No one lists verse 5 with Charleston anymore?  Where’s the love?

I’ve got your love right here, lobster. How’s this?

That treasure corresponds to Image 5 and Verse 12.

Mr. Preiss did indeed tell me there is a casque in St. Louis.

That is the most difficult step in the whole process, matching the correct picture and verse.  I had recently thought that I was at a solution for a casque, but I believe I had the wrong verse with the (I hope) correct picture.  That is also the reason my father and I were tragically close to the Chicago treasure 20 years ago.  Alas, correct picture but wrong verse.  I do not see any easy method of proper pairing of verse and picture.  Perhaps there is a method that I am blind to.
–Johann

Some time ago, I tried to contact employees of both of Chicago’s large newspapers and they could not locate any information or stories relating to the found casque.  Maybe I just happened to get the wrong people….maybe not.  I would love to find this invisible man.

I am stunned that this invisible man is not still searching or working on the book!  The prizes are only becoming more valuable.

boogieman – my pleasure!
The X in Image 9 is the Roman numeral 10, and refers to the 10th month (October).
Each of the 12 images contains a reference to a month (see my previous post), where the number corresponds to the month in the usual way (i.e., 1 = January, etc.). Each image also contains the traditional birthstone and birthflower for that month. See my reply #109 (July 3, 2005) on this thread for the full list.
It is not clear what, if anything, the month/birthflower/birthstone has to do with locating casques. Perhaps nothing. They were not necessary for finding either the Cleveland or Chicago casques, and I can think of no post hoc connection between them and the solutions.

Hey, thanks dude!  Seems that finding the conection with that theme would pretty much solve this whole damn thing. Obviously those things are there for a reason. I’ve always consentrated on the link between Native Americans and the place where the Fair People came from even before I found this site a year ago.  As well as this site has evolved, reading back just throws me for a loop. Let me try to line all this up:
Native Americans
Fair People
Foriegn Countries
Birth Stone
Birth Month
Birth Flower
300 years ago (+ or – ) (from 1982)
12 images
12 verses
12 locations (one in Canada)
only ten remain
Looks easy….

Unknown

Unknown:
im new and i was wondering if the image number is the same as the verse number and if not, does anyone know so far what images go to what verses.  :-*

I hate to state the obvious but you need only look back two postings…

im new and i was wondering if the image number is the same as the verse number and if not, does anyone know so far what images go to what verses.  :-*

Oculus, you just have to look at the chart.
As requested, I am going to re-order the chart in the order of the months.  I am also probably going to get some sneers from some of you, but I am going to put in my proposed solutions, including what has still not been matched (yes, I’m taking out Florida).  Okay, here it is, in order of the months, with question marks next to the ones we are still debating:
Boston ——— Image 3? —- Verse 3 —– 1st? month — England?
Devil Kill Hill? —- Image 10 — Verse 11? — 2nd month — Germany
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse 7? —– 6th month — China
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month — Italy
Canada? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month — Spain
St. Louis? ——- Image 9 —- Verse ? —– 10th month — Dutch
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse ? —– 12th month — France
Unsure:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 9 (funny man)(Dutch)
Image 10 (juggler)(Germany)
Verses 2, 5, 6, 8, & 9
Other Locations, but no room for them:  Florida, Milwaukee, San Diego, Pittsburgh, etc…  🙁
Please note that the St. Louis and Canada locations could easily switch — so far, we have no clues attaching either city to either image (as far as I am aware).

Oculus, you just have to look at the chart.
As requested, I am going to re-order the chart in the order of the months.  I am also probably going to get some sneers from some of you, but I am going to put in my proposed solutions, including what has still not been matched (yes, I’m taking out Florida).  Okay, here it is, in order of the months, with question marks next to the ones we are still debating:
Boston ——— Image 3? —- Verse 3 —– 1st? month — England?
Devil Kill Hill? —- Image 10 — Verse 11? — 2nd month — Germany
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse 7? —– 6th month — China
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month — Italy
Canada
? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month — Spain
St. Louis? ——- Image 9 —- Verse ? —– 10th month — Dutch
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse ? —– 12th month — France
Unsure:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 9 (funny man)(Dutch)
Image 10 (juggler)(Germany)
Verses 2, 5, 6, 8, & 9
Other Locations, but no room for them:  Florida, Milwaukee, San Diego, Pittsburgh, etc…  🙁
Please note that the St. Louis and
Canada
locations could easily switch — so far, we have no clues attaching either city to either image (as far as I am aware).

yep, i also spent a lot of time yesterday with New Brunswick.  The greatest influx of Irish immigrants in Canada seems to have come thru there.  Halifax, NS is not a very large city, but it is an immigration port, and they have a fort there known as The Citadel.
I am concentrating on image 10 for Canada, and I would love to find the building in silhouette on this picture.
(We should have started a new thread for this latest discussion, to save this thread for “what we know” summaries.)

Unknown

Unknown:
…my intuition tells me that the Canadian treasure will be in a port city, somewhere with a history of real immigrants.  (Even Cleveland has a port on the Great Lakes, and Salt Lake City is the ultimate story of emigrants establishing a new home.)  I’ve been concentrating on Victoria, BC and Toronto, ON so far, looking at Montreal next.

Ah… don’t overlook the Ottawa (the Capital of Canada); Niagara Falls (the Honey-Moon Capital of the World); Quebec City (Capital of Quebec); all of these are on navigation systems and would be well-enough known and captured in pictures to be readily searchable for the arm-chair hunter out there. I suggest – strictly based on population distribution that you could give the east-coast a pass. By the way if you are considering Victoria – you must also look at Vancouver, larger – also has a port.

Stercox,
I think you’re right that it only needs to be a “pretty good” fit for the immigrants, and that there were no hard-and-fast rules of association.  I suspect BP had the list of fair folk countries, picked out the obvious connections, for continuity’s sake (like the French in New Orleans) and then had a few left-overs, like probably at least Greece and Arabia.  The Arabia-Houston connection was probably oil (in my mind) and after a little looking around he probably figured that Cleveland was as good a candidate as he was going to find.
The whole thing seems to fit the actual immigration / landing pattern pretty well, which is one reason I’m strong on the Dutch at NY and the Russians at Vancouver.
Where in the Cleveland area are you?  I used to travel to the Solon area for work a lot, but didn’t learn about
The Secret
until afterwards.  Kindof a letdown to think that I had spent a bunch of time in Cleveland when there was a jewel there, and I never even knew about it.
Pine

Hi. First off, I’m a big newbie. My girlfriend brought home a copy of “A Treasure’s Trove” and I’ve since become addicted. Anyway, I live in Chicago (not the suburbs but the actual city) and am pretty familliar with Grant Park as I went to college across the street. I have to go pick up some things this week and can take some pictures if you can give an idea what I’m looking for.

Egbert–
I strongly believe that the question mark can now be taken from the “St. Louis”/image 9 on the chart.  Check out the latest discovery on the image 9 thread.  If you feel that the evidence is strong enough, you may want to consider it decisive.  If not, we are in need of help in the midwest.
Well, I’m sure many of you think the midwest needs help.
Thanks for all you are doing here.

It is certainly more than coincidental that the book, “Abroad in America: visitors to the new nation, 1776-1914” (by Marc Pachter), contains excerpts found in 2 of the verses from The Secret.  The book came out in 1976, around the time when Byron Preiss came up with his idea of burying treasures across America using the theme of “visitors to the new nation.”  He was involved in book publishing, and must have had this book when he came up with the verses.  My friend Siskel and I are going to get the book and look through it for other references.  Hopefully, other treasure seekers here will do the same, and we will find other references.  This could develop into our “Rosetta Stone.”

I recently physically traced the Chicago find in order to see how it worked.  It was found in Grant Park along the lakeshore.  Image 5 has the famous watertower in the upper right corner, as a windmill that probably refers to the “Windy City,” even though that nickname originally referred to the shifty Chicago politicians.  To the left is a silhouette of one of two Indian-Archers-on-Horseback statues at an entrance to the park very near the treasure site, which was near the Art Institute museum.  The fairy pouring water is a sideview of one of five woman-figures (none with wings) in the statue “The Spirit of the Great Lakes” in an outdoor courtyard of the museum.  Each statue represents one of the lakes, and they pour water down into each others shell-bowls in the order in which the lakes flow into one another.  The fence-image in the archway looks exactly like the fence posts along the fence at the treasure site.
Now for Verse 5:
“Where M and B are set in stone
And to Congress, R is known”–Man and Beast are the Indian
statues, which are cast in bronze but fixed to stone
bases.  They are at Congress Street near the Congress
Hotel, which was the site of that infamous 1960s
Democratic Convention riot.  The RR tracks of the
commuter trains are there too and run alongside the
fence where was the treasure.
“L sits and left / Beyond his shoulder / Is the Fair Folks’ /
Treasure holder”–Facing the Abraham Lincoln statue,
beyond his shoulder, which is his right shoulder but
left to you who are facing Abe, you can see along
the fence to your left as it ends in a concrete wall
not too far in the distance, near the art museum.
“The end of ten by thirteen / Is your clue”–The wall is
alongside Jackson St. (J=10th letter) which nearby
to your right, if you are at the wall, it meets
Monroe St. (M=13th letter).  Since these streets
are running up towards the lakeshore here, they
simply must end.
“Fence and fixture / Central too”–The fence meets the
concrete wall (to your left) and on the wall is an
electrical box (to your right).  I assume the casque
was buried exactly/Central between these two.
We’d have to contact the finder for the details.
“For finding jewel casque / Seek the sounds / Of rumble /
Brush and music / Hush.”–The rumble is obviously the train,
the brush is naturally throughout the park, and I’m
not sure about the music.  The Petrillo Music Shell
may not be close enough to actually hear the music
unless the volume was turned up.  There is not always
a performance there.  Perhaps if one really did “Hush”
the occasional music could be heard, but perhaps one
should respectfully keep “Hush” when a mounted cop
asks you who you are burying with that shovel.  This
is Chicago.
–Johann

New Yorkers have made it to the bottom of my list!  I guess I expect too much, being from the South.  Well, at any rate, I’m telling my story and letting it cause what destruction it may.
Let’s pair verse six and picture 3.  Two arms extende and the bar that binds?  Yeah.
So take into account first, the first lines of verse 6:
Of all the romance retold
Men of tales and tunes
Cruel and bold
Seen here
By eyes of old

Huh?

The onion domed church  was constructed in 1954

Is this in West Vancouver by chance?  I have some ideas/discoveries, which I will post on the image 12 and verse 10 threads.

I’ve been doing some thinking about matching Ps to Vs lately, which led to some musing about the “month / hour” theme. I think the “month / hour” associated with each image is given by:
P1
: clock
P2
: clock
P3
: clock
P4
: triangle
P5
: number of warts
P6
: number of asters
P7
: clock
P8
: number of columns
P9
: number of petals on the calendula
P10
: number of red balls
P11
: number of gold squares in the hoop under the big globe
P12
: clock
Does anyone disagree? My suggestions for P9 and P11 might be new. Useful? Who knows, but if we can eliminate these parts of the images as cues to the month theme, then these details probably have nothing to do with the solution and can be safely ignored.

Well, thanks to Stercox and his Florida find, I think we can now update the locations, which we have not done in quite some time.
Okay, here it is, in order of the months, with question marks next to the ones we are still debating:
Boston? ——– Image 3 —– Verse 3? —- 1st month —- England
Milwaukee ——- Image 10 — Verse 8 —- 2nd month — Germany
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse 7? —– 6th month — China
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Kill Devil Hills? — Image 11 — Verse 11? —- 8th month — Italy
St. Augustine — Image 6 —- Verse 9 —– 9th month — Spain
St. Louis? ——- Image 9 —- Verse ? —– 10th month — Dutch
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse ? —– 12th month — France
Unsure:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 9 (gnome)(Dutch)
Verses 2, 5, & 6
Other Locations, but no room for them:  Canada, Salt Lake City, San Diego, Pittsburgh, etc…
Please note that the Boston, Kill Devil Hills and St. Louis locations could easily switch — so far, we have no clues attaching those cities to any image (as far as I am aware).  Nevertheless, since Image 9 may lead to the Jewel Box in St. Louis (the collar looks like the building), and since everyone likes Image 3 and Boston, I stuck Kill Devil Hills in the remaining spot.
Please let me know your comments and thoughts on this, everyone!

I am trying to find out how to access the archives of either the Chicago Tribune or the Chicago Sun-Times, but I am not getting anywhere.  One of the Archives goes back to 1985 online, but I was unable to find an article on The Secret.  Going back further probably involves a number of calls and some money.
Anyone in the area willing to go there?
On the subject of the gems/months/etc. system, it certainly appears that the fairies’ “immigration” into North America somewhat parallels the real immigration.  Irish in Chicago.  Russians (mostly Russian jews) in New York.  Spanish in Florida.  English in Massachusetts.  French in Louisiana.  It is starting to make sense.
Here is a link which discusses the major immigration ports, etc.:
http://www.genealogybranches.com/arrivalports.html
The 5 major ports are Boston (Image 3?), New York (Image 12), Philadelphia (Image 4), Baltimore (?), and New Orleans (Image 7).  There was also a port in Galveston, Texas.
Perhaps I am going way out on a tangent on this one, but the flavor of the pictures seem to suggest the actual immigrant population that arrived in the city.

Hi Everybody!
Just making myself known, I’ll be getting my copy of The Secret in the next few days and am looking foward to putting my thoughts into the melting pot. Going through the arduous catching up phase but I hope to be ready to work by the time the book gets here!
Yoroshiku Onegaishimasu
-Matt

Unknown

Unknown:
I am going to put in my proposed solutions, including what has still not been matched.
Other Locations, but no room for them:  Florida, Milwaukee, San Diego, Pittsburgh, etc…  🙁

Okay, so I was wrong.
It looks like Image 10 is Milwaukee.  Here is an update:
Okay, here it is, in order of the months, with question marks next to the ones we are still debating:
Boston? ——– Image 3 —– Verse 3? —- 1st month —- England?
Milwaukee ——- Image 10 — Verse 8 —- 2nd month — Germany
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse 7? —– 6th month — China
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Canada? ——– Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month — Italy
Kill Devil Hill? —- Image 6 —- Verse 11? —- 9th month — Spain
St. Louis? ——- Image 9 —- Verse ? —– 10th month — Dutch
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse ? —– 12th month — France
Unsure:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 6 (conquistador)(Spain)
Image 9 (gnome)(Dutch)
Verses 2, 5, 6 & 9
Other Locations, but no room for them:  Florida, Salt Lake City, San Diego, Pittsburgh, etc…
Please note that the Devil Kill Hill, St. Louis and Canada locations could easily switch — so far, we have no clues attaching those cities to any image (as far as I am aware).  Nevertheless, since Image 9 may lead to the Jewel Box in St. Louis (the collar looks like the building), and since 112 degrees in Image 11 probably points to Canada(112 doesn’t go with the other 2 cities), I stuck Devil Kill Hill in the remaining spot.
Please let me know your comments and thoughts on this, everyone!

Unknown

Unknown:
I am going to put in my proposed solutions, including what has still not been matched.
Other Locations, but no room for them:  Florida, Milwaukee, San Diego, Pittsburgh, etc…  🙁

Okay, so I was wrong.
It looks like Image 10 is Milwaukee.  Here is an update:
Okay, here it is, in order of the months, with question marks next to the ones we are still debating:
Boston? ——– Image 3 —– Verse 3? —- 1st month —- England?
Milwaukee ——- Image 10 — Verse 8 —- 2nd month — Germany
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse 7? —– 6th month — China
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Canada
? ——– Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month — Italy
Kill Devil Hill? —- Image 6 —- Verse 11? —- 9th month — Spain
St. Louis? ——- Image 9 —- Verse ? —– 10th month — Dutch
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse ? —– 12th month — France
Unsure:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 6 (conquistador)(Spain)
Image 9 (gnome)(Dutch)
Verses 2, 5, 6 & 9
Other Locations, but no room for them:  Florida, Salt Lake City, San Diego, Pittsburgh, etc…
Please note that the Devil Kill Hill, St. Louis and
Canada
locations could easily switch — so far, we have no clues attaching those cities to any image (as far as I am aware).  Nevertheless, since Image 9 may lead to the Jewel Box in St. Louis (the collar looks like the building), and since 112 degrees in Image 11 probably points to
Canada
(112 doesn’t go with the other 2 cities), I stuck Devil Kill Hill in the remaining spot.
Please let me know your comments and thoughts on this, everyone!

From the older posting:
Here’s a verse in the book that describes each of the jewels.
This may help interpreting some of the pics:
What are the treasures the Fair Folk bring?
Easily named, and lovingly told:
Fairies of England proudly bear
Garnet, crown-jewel of their Queen.
Brilliant as the eyes of Celtic folk,
Cold morning green, their Emerald.
The Hadas of Iberia:
Sapphire, shy as a wild field flower.
Turquoise the Fays of France keep: stone
Rare as a blue midsummer’s day.
Dwarves’ treasure: purple Amethyst,
Imperial star of Germany.
The Opal of the Lowland Gnomes:
A cloud of shining, shifting smoke.
A Topaz is the Russian prize:
The royal sunstone, frozen fire.
Peridot of old Italy:
antique, and olivine, and rich.
The Ruby out of Araby:
Scarlet of the desert sky at dawn.
Africa’s Diamond, earth-born star,
Bright harvest of the midnight rock.
The Nymphs of Hellas cherish sweet
Aquamarine, spring-water clear.
From far Cathay, the dragon’s Pearl:
Chaste, perfect as the silver moon.
Each jewel in its weird-wrought casque,
Gift of the Viking craftsmen Elves.
Wonder and glory thirteen-fold:
These are the treasures the Fair Folk bring.

There also may have been some confusion early in some threads regarding the true color of the gemstones as compared to the lower quality online images (prior to the high-res ones).
Image 11’s is most definitely green and should be Italy — “olivine.”
That leaves the purple Amethyst and Germany with Image 10, though it is not the most purple thing I’ve ever seen.
I’ve read a great deal about German immigrants in St. Louis and there seem to be quite a few monuments to or about Germans.  In your experience, Johann, would you consider the German-St. Louis history to be on par with Irish-Chicago?

Cat–
I hope you do find pic 10 in Canada.  I had been considering this pic for St. Louis and came up with nearly zero.
I have heard it expressed somewhere on the board that this is the Italian pic.  What do you think?  I considered that the red balls were Bocce balls for lack of a better identification.
–Johann

Actually (sombody correct me if I’m wrong), I thought that Image 9 was Dutch, Image 10 was German, and Image 11 was Italian.
And there is also a “Citadel” in Quebec City, near the palatial hotel.

Unknown

Unknown:
(We should have started a new thread for this latest discussion, to save this thread for “what we know” summaries.)

I couldn’t agree more… I’ll start a new thread on Canada if no-one minds (or beats me too it).

Okay, here is the latest summary, with the addition of the countries from where the fairies originate:
Boston ——— Image ? —– Verse 3 —— ?? month
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month —Africa
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month — Ireland
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month — Greece
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month — Arabia
Kill Devil Hill —— Image ? —- Verse 11 —– ?? month
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse 7? —- 12th month — France
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month — Russia
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month — Italy
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse ? —— 6th month — China
Florida?? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month — Spain
Unmatched:
Image 3 (armor)(England)
Image 9 (funny man)(Dutch)
Image 10 (juggler)(Germany)
Verses 2, 5, 6, 8, & 9
Locations:  St. Louis & Canada
So, if 2 treasures are in St. Louis & Canada, then one of the locations in the chart is incorrect, since that would give us 13 locations.  The most tenuous ones appear to be Florida and Salt Lake City.
For those new to the board, there is a theory that where the fairies are from is a clue as to where the treasures are hidden.  Chicago has a large Irish immigrant population, and the Irish fairies’ treasure was found there.  The Greek fairies’ treasure was found in the Greek Cultural Garden in Cleveland.  Thus, it would make sense that, for example, the French fairies’ treasure is hidden in New Orleans and the Chinese treasure is hidden in San Francisco, etc.

I could use clarification about pics 10 and 11.  How do we know which is Italian and which is German?
I do not intend to be argumentative.  I genuinely do not know the style and details that establish German or Italian.
This is shameful to me.  I am half Italian.
–Johann

Nothing to be embarrassed about Johann.  The countries are being associated with the pictures solely because of the type of gemstone/birthmonth/birthflower in each picture.  For those new to the board, there is a “poem” about the fairies’ countries of origin and which gemstones they carry.  The Italian fairies bring the peridot, which appears to be the gem in picture 11.  The German fairies bring the amethyst, which we agreed had to be picture 10 by process of elimination.  I forgot which thread all this was in — it could have been this thread actually.

I included St Louis because of Johann’s email from Byron Preiss confirming that there was one buried there

Congratulations Egbert on your find.
You are a true example of an Armchair Treasure Hunter.
I would like to suggest verse 6 to go with picture 6,
only due to the fact that the verse mentions both
palms and sand.
I still believe that the verse directs you to Key West, Fl.

Chart update.  Switching Image 3 for Image 9.  It appears that Roanoke Island is in Image 3.
Boston ——— Image ? —– Verse 3 —— ?? month
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month
Kill Devil Hill —— Image 3? — Verse 11 —- 1st month?
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse 7? —- 12th month
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse ? —— 6th month
Florida?? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month
Images 9 (funny man) & 10 (juggler) haven’t been matched yet.
Verses 2, 5, 8, & 9 haven’t been matched yet.

either im blind, or you guys have a different book than i do, but Roanoke Island looks nothing like that “shape” in the picture.  they have a decent general shape match, but what so far in this hunt has been a “general match” ??  its always been EXACT.  and thats the only way that it could have been designed, beacause of things just like this.  Anyway, if that shape is in fact a clue, it’ll be found in Boston somewhere.  Im 100 percent sure that image 3 goes with it.  And im getting close to a starting location, just need that final “ah-ha!”.

so far we have definite or strong links to the following cities from verse or image
Chicago
Cleveland
Houston
New Orleans
Charleston
San Francisco
Boston
St Louis
Roanoake/Wright Bros memorial
That leaves 2 unknown US cities (plus 1 in Canada) and we have had speculation about
New York (statue of liberty face)
Atlanta (3 stories of Mitchell verse)
Salt Lake City (image clues)
Key West/Florida (image and verse clues)
Wash DC (image lat/long)
which means that 3 of these (or more) are incorrect. I think New York and Atlanta are probably the strongest. I’m going to try to find more connections with those two. Hopefully we can soon narrow down the list to 11 definitive US cities. Does anyone have any disagreement with the 9 “known” cities? any other candidates not mentioned?

I don’t think we’ve found any verse or pic that matches St.Louis yet, so I haven’t included it.  Due to the controversy over Image 3 and to which city it refers (Boston or Roanoke), I’ll take that Image out of the chart for now.  I’ll also leave my suggestion out for now of Image 9 possibly matching Roanoke.  So, I believe these are the clues we have relative agreement on:
Boston ——— Image ? —– Verse 3 —— ?? month
Charleston —— Image 2 —- Verse ? —— 4th month
Chicago ——– Image 5 —– Verse 12 —– 5th month
Cleveland ——- Image 4 —- Verse 4 —— 3rd month
Houston ——— Image 8 —- Verse 1 —— 7th month
Kill Devil Hill —— Image ? —- Verse 11 —– ?? month
New Orleans —– Image 7 —- Verse 7? —- 12th month
New York City — Image 12 — Verse 10? — 11th month
Salt Lake City — Image 11 — Verse ? —— 8th month
San Francisco — Image 1 —- Verse ? —— 6th month
Florida?? ——– Image 6 —- Verse ? —— 9th month
Unmatched:
Images 3 (armor), 9 (funny man) & 10 (juggler).
Verses 2, 5, 6, 8, & 9.

On Line Article about Egbert’s find.
http://www.cleveland.com/sundaymag/plai … 842130.xml

was boston found? bingo just sent me a img of what someone says is plexiglass box lid? credible?
I find it hard to believe it wold be intact and not damaged from weather.
https://imgur.com/a/IHYcv0c

well…to me its of direct pertinence…as ive already purchased my ticket for boston! lol
and was to leave to dig up the casque next week…hence why id like to know more info, speculation or not…at least the source so I can corroborate myself…

link didn’t work for me, was the image taken down?

it looked very similar to that image, image was posted yesterday morning and taken down pretty much immediately after I posted this thread…which leads me to believe it was prob either bingo or strike…bingo wouldn’t say where he got info from.

My lid looked like this,

You can buy the right sized piece of plexiglass at most hardware stores for a few bucks, and cover it with dirt for free. If that’s all the proof they have, I wouldn’t attach too much significance to it.

also, there could be other things buried in similar containers, things like geocaches and local events. If only a plexiglass sheet has been found, if only a photo of plastic is offered as proof, PLEASE do not suggest a casque has been recovered. PLEASE. A casque will be considered found when a *casque* is FOUND.

More has been said about this than should have been.
This entire thread is based on speculation and jumping to conclusions. And, of course, reacting to those speculated conclusions.
If an actual casque is recovered, this forum will be promptly informed.

Poland.  Thinking about it.

Hello. This is my first post since discovery this damn secret. I find myself thinking about the verses at random times. Very annoying. Anyway, not having read everything on the board yet, I wanted to put a few things down. I live on the east side of Milwaukee close to Lake Park. Just some notes, if they are already here somewhere I apologize. These all point to different places, just ideas.
1. 92 steps, could be a building completed in 1892. Not actual steps.
2. Walk the beating of the world. Walk the beat- world, walk down Old World Third Street. Could also be in reference to 1918 and the end of WW1. 18 runs through downtown including the Wisconsin Club, the Mitchell Manor.
3. Step on nature, cast in copper. Kosciusko Park is in the Lincoln neighborhood. The park itself is cast in Lincoln.
4. The face of the juggler resembles greatly the Immigrant Mother statue in Cathedral Square. The halo – Catherdral Square. The letter could be her. Also, the red balls could be in reference to the MSOE logo adjacent to the square as the O is filled in red. Also, the jugglers circle of items could be a nod to the square.
5. A juggler is a deceiver. The image itself could purposely be throwing us off the track.
6. Juggler also refers to leading up a garden. Having dove into that one yet.
Just a few things I didn’t see anywhere else yet. If anyone in Milwaukee wants to meet and discuss, I am totally game. Thanks!

I’ve been thinking much on this verse this week. I want to be careful to inspect each line for possible meanings, rather I don’t want to carelessly brush aside a valuable instruction/inspiration.
How is “viewing” of the three stories of Mitchell essential to getting us closer to the casque? Firstly, I noticed the Wisconsin Club has it’s ground floor and two floors above that, making for three stories, but there’s an observation tower and flagpole that effectively stacks two more levels higher, making it 5 stories all together. I think it later becomes important when we look at the proud, tall fifth with a sense of observation for what’s being held even higher. That may be the key to linking some visual component(s) in image 10 to a good dig spot.
I’ve also been working out the justification for the lines “at a distance in time” and “at a distance in space”.
League (unit) = a distance measured for how far a person walks in 1 hour
Light-Year (unit) = the distance light travels in 1 year
I wonder if the line of verse about walking 100 paces is also a baseline for establishing a distance that relates to a city block. Based on the standard of 30 in. or 76.2 cm for 1 pace, 100 paces is 76 meters. In many cases the city block is recognized as 80 meters in width though many are much greater in length, 80m x 274m in Manhatten for instance.

otteriffic, do you know when this staircase was changed to a rampway
http://content.mpl.org/cdm/singleitem/c … 948/rec/26
now gmap
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.051053, … LRdNYw!2e0

fox

“Remember, remember the fifth of November,
gunpowder, treason and plot, “
these are the first two lines of a rhyme for Guy Fawkes Day aka The Gunpowder Plot
Now….back to:
such a lovely statue of Erastus B. Wolcott sitting tall atop his proud horse named Gunpowder.
anything around Gunpowder’s southern foot?

Hi again. Tried to post a few days ago but it seems it was not approved by admin. Going through everything but lots of links are broke as this thread is ten years old. Anyway, I am from Milwaukee and I live here. I am a stay at home mom with too much time on my hands. So I’m having fun researching all this and have made a few trips to north point light house but never for reasons of the hunt. So the statue referenced above has “devotion to country printed into it”. Anyway. Hopefully this posts. Anyone else from Mke?

maltedfalcon

If I cant figure out that first one, I am going to assume
verse 7 is not GGpark.

hmmm…looking better and better for my N.O. theory

You are probably going to be hating me…

maltedfalcon

You are probably going to be hating me…

why so?

What would you consider the “Letter from the country…” in this scenario?

slappybuns

i missed that post, i thought i read where 10 was for “J” jackson street, and 13 was for “M” monroe street

No, it was for the grove of trees.

i missed that post, i thought i read where 10 was for “J” jackson street, and 13 was for “M” monroe street

to me most importantly this idea lacks the Oh Yeah! Thats it, I get it factor.”
Which every clue in the found casques has.
Each clue once solved has basically been obvious.
In the examples we have,  what clues has been similarly obtuse?
The clue stated harpsichord, not virginal yet neither are associated with the statue, beyond a wikipedia article stating an instrument is typically played by women.
I agree the analytics should continue.
however we need to fit the ideas to the verses not the verses to the ideas.
how easy it is to step from its a statue of a woman to women play virginals, to Round yon virginal, Ah the verse has something to do with “Silent Night”  suddenly you are researching stuff that while interesting has nothing to do with BPs treasure hunt.
I certainly dont want to marginalize any of your ideas, you have come up with some great ones.
But if I think you come up with one that is out of left field. I will say so, as always, feel free to ignore anything I say-
I have been wrong many many many times.

I like the Oh Yeah! Reconciliation idea.  At some point I hope one of my Oh Huh?! Ideas pans out.

more likely the lines a straight forward and clear if you are in the right place.
and do not contain levels of hidden meaning

This may help us to verify the starting point of the verse.
(To which “Mitchell” building was BP referring?)
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world
You pass Mitchell Hall on Kenwood Blvd.
In the past, we have thought that Kenwood, because of its stereo speakers,
may have been the “beating of the world” reference.
But I just found out that Kenwood, since 1947, has also been a kitchen appliance manufacturer…
specifically…”beaters”…or mixers. They introduced the double-beater! This makes more of the
case for Mitchell Hall on Kenwood Blvd. as our point of origin…instead of the Mitchell Mansion on Wisconsin Ave.
As much as I love the statue of Solomon Juneau, I still think the treasure was buried nearer the lion bridges…
(Your PDF of the Milwaukee treasure info was very nicely done, WhiteRabbit!)
AP

Well if that doesn’t beat all! Good research, AP.

As you walk the beating of the world
Or…Kenwood Blvd, from Mitchell Hall to Marietta Ave. World pillow-fighting championships.
http://www.kenwoodpillowfights.com/

slappybuns

lincoln, tall and proud …….if it’s not the lions  ;D

Southern foot / southpaw…boxing…”wildcat”
Ad Wolgast
, Milwaukee world boxing champion 1910…

Where have you dug?  This question also applies to everyone who has already dug somewhere.  I am putting pins on a map to narrow everything down…

Unknown

Unknown:
Oh and i forgot to mention… a Pace, as in a step taken, is the distance between each time your right foot hits the ground (or your left, depending on which you prefer to count)… On average, your steps are farther apart going down hill, and closer together going up hill.  The average distance between them is about one meter;  However, a human being usually takes between 50 and 70 steps to equal 100m.  I am 5’10 and my 100m pacecount is about 67 steps (where my right foot hits the ground).  That was measured carrying about 25lbs. of extra weight, which included a shovel, coincidentally, and where I was wearing boots (the ankle support figures into this by how much your ankles will carry you with each step).  By the way– why is Germany the country of wonderstone’s hearth?  Why couldn’t it be Spain?  Or England?

Quote from Typler
100 meters converts to 109.3 yards.  If 67 paces is 109.3 yards SE from the bridge for Typler, where does that leave us at Lake park?  At 100 paces, we are 163 yards SE of the bridge. More than 1 1/2 football fields away.  Can a pace mean something else?

Hmmmmmm….  I don’t know…  I don’t think this looks much like the Lincoln memorial….

forest_blight

Yes, but
Lincoln Memorial
Drive.
Lincoln
Memorial
.
BP is playing clever word games with us.

FB, when you think about it, that could probably be (to date) the biggest breakthrough we have concerning The Secret’s secret verses.

No dude – Lincoln Memorial Drive.

boogieman

FB, when you think about it, that could probably be (to date) the biggest breakthrough we have concerning The Secret’s secret verses.

I would personally nominate ‘SELOY’ confirmer as the biggest breakthrough.
If we could have ONE breakthrough for each verse, this would be much easier.

VERSE 8
I thought I would take the opportunity to try to summarize what we think we know about this verse..
View the three stories of Mitchell
Start at Mitchell Hall which is a three story building on the campus of the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee.  It is on the corner of E. Kenwood Blvd. and N. Downer Ave.
As you walk the beating of the world
Across from Mitchell Hall is a building that used to be a synagogue(if I am remembering this thread correctly).  The phrase
the beating of the world
is from a Jewish Shabbat ceremony.
In the quiet of my soul I
Feel
the beating of the World
.
It is not other than I
nor am I other than it.
As wave is to ocean so am I to the World
and to the source that sustains it.
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
As you walk down E. Kenwood Blvd toward Lake Park you cross N. Downer Ave., N. Hackett Ave., and N. Sheppard Ave which were all named for people who lived in Milwaukee.
At a distance in space
From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
Not a clue, we’re not even sure how this part of the verse is read.  Is the woman playing the harpsichord or are the woman and the harpsichord separate items?  Is the harpsichord playing silently or is the woman playing silently? Is it an individual woman or did BP mean women in general?  And what is that comma doing in there?  BP was very frugal with his punctuation so I would guess it means something.
Step on nature
Cast in copper
Enter Lake Park on Lincoln Memorial Dr.  Kenwood Blvd. becomes LMD as you enter the park.
Ascend the 92 steps
Go up the stairs of the Grand Staircase in Lake Park which has exactly 92 steps.  There is a series of pictures on this forum showing the staircase with numbers superimposed over them and there are exactly 92 steps.
After climbing the grand 200
From above the outline of the Grand Staircase is a double C.  Two C’s in Roman numerals equal 200.
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk through the golf course(I believe that the two red balls she is juggling in the image are golf tee markers and this is also where that huge multi-trunk birch tree was.  It is now quietly decomposing just off the edge of the golf course in the trees.) and get to N. Wahl Ave.  The start of both Ravine 1 and Ravine 2 are on this street.  They run parrallel to each other and you have to pass the Northpoint Lighthouse either way but only in Ravine 1 can you find
the foot of a culvert below the bridge
.  Go down Ravine 1, pass the Northpoint Lighthouse(we believe that this is the compass from the verse because compasses point north), pass under the Lions Head bridge and over a wooden footbridge(the wooden footbridge is almost directly under the Lions Head bridge.)  And then in a stone embankment just past the wooden footbridge is the foot of the culvert.  This can be seen in some pictures I posted in the Milwaukee Update thread.
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
Ravine 1 continues southeast at this point(and the trail is both rock and soil) and it is about 100 paces(depends on how you count a pace) from the foot of the culvert to where the trail ends as you come back out onto LMD
To the first young birch
Dunno, I’m not a tree expert and the trees there are so tall now that it is difficult to get a good look at their leaves.  But I am prepared to believe that there is or was a young birch tree there.
Pass three, staying west
At this point, the verse becomes moot(or debatable as shecrab reminded us).  If you turn right as you exit Ravine 1 you will immediately see three more obvious trees followed by another tree that is both proud and tall.  However, this tree does not have
a letter from the country of wonderstones hearth
, it does not look like the tree in the fold of her cape, and several intrepid members of this forum dug around this tree and found nothing.
I believe
staying west
just tells us to stay on the west side of LMD.
If you turn left as you exit Ravine 1 and walk about 15-20 feet you will see(if your eyes are good) the tree that animalpainter found that has a G carved into the bark.  She dug there and also found nothing, however, there is a cement retaining wall at the base of tree that was put in after BP buried the casque.  Animalpainter believes that the casque is under the cement.
If you look on a map of the path that you have walked from the top of the Grand Staircase to the bottom of Ravine 1 you will notice that you have roughly walked in a circle.  I believe that that is why there is a circle in the image.  BP was showing us the path to follow.  So my current thinking is that the spot we are looking for is back on the other side of the Grand Staircase.  I wish my current thinking had coincided with when I was in Milwaukee so I could check this out.  Incidently there are two war memorial in that area.  The first one(as you are entering the park and walking toward the Grand Staircase) is dedicated to Mary E. Spence, a past national president of the American War Mothers.  The second one is closer to the Grand staircase and is dedicated to those who died in WWI.  This second memorial consists of a plaque and some trees.
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
This part is very moot.  I think we have had speculation on just about every letter of the alphabet for this one. G=Germany, D=Deutschland, and all the letters that those two words contain.
The G stands out because there are two Girl Scout markers hammered into two trees in Lake Park.  One of them is near the start of Ravine 2.  The other is at the end of the Parking Lot Ravine(at the soccer field between Ravine 1 and the Grand Staircase).  Also because animalpainter found a G carved into a tree near the bottom of Ravine 1.
I have another thought.  The German alphabet contains 30 letters while the English alphabet only has 26.  The additional four letters are: ë, ü, ö, ß.  The third letter, ö, could be represented by the remains of a sheared off branch with two smaller ones directly above the larger one.  However, I looked for this when I was in Milwaukee and didn’t see anything like this.
On a proud, tall fifth
At its southern foot
I’m assuming this is the tree that is represented by the fold in her cape.  That tree does have what I would describe as a foot.
The treasure awaits.
Yep, it has been waiting for quite awhile.
Just to recap, these are the things that I believe we still need to find
the woman and the harpsichord
the first young birch
the three things you need to pass
the letter from the country of wonderstones hearth
the proud tall fifth
AP may have found the letter from wonderstones hearth.  Could you give us some more details about where the tree is located?  Does it look like the tree in the fold of the woman’s cape?  Does it have a southern foot?  Also, what program did you use to put the circle and the words on your pics?

Nice job digger – to think it took so much argueing to
get to be within feet of this one.
http://search.isp.netscape.com/nsisp/bo … FLake1.pdf
To help out the visually impared.

Nice summary!

Right.  I was seriously hoping it was more profound than that.  Not that I’m criticizing it… There’s also a Lincoln Park, and a statue of Ole’ Honest Abe on a bridge too…  I also discovered that those tiles ARE throughout Pere Marquette Park… on the sidewalk…  As it happens, PMP is also slanted, going from NW to SE, and has bridges at the north and south sides which cross the Milwaukee.  The Historical Society shares the land (its the triangular building in the SW corner), and I would be wrong to discount the fact that every year they have a festival called “Milwaukee Rhythms” or something to that effect.  Granted, this is only its twelfth year, but shecrab taught me a long time ago not to discount what fortune drops in front of you… To preclude the inevitable:  “>sigh< It's only 13 years old, KLBT" from fox, let me clarify-- It may be sign from the fae that we're on the right track.

Unknown

Unknown:
There’s also a Lincoln Park, and a statue of Ole’ Honest Abe on a bridge too…

Yes, but
Lincoln Memorial
Drive.
Lincoln
Memorial
.
BP is playing clever word games with us.

with a summary like that, we should have that darn treasure in our hands. very nicely put indeed digger.

I Third it!
Here’s the problem with having too many threads, I can’t find diggers pic of the culvert.
I’d like to pose a question though….
Pass the compass and reach the foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
A culvert could be considered the drainpipe, the bridge or roadway that passes over it, or the
channel
it is going into.
The ravine.
Again, if BP used
ravine
in the verse instead of
culvert
, it would be too easy.  Can this verse fit to where you actually pass right next to the North Point going west to the
start
of the ravine?  If you are going to consider 100 paces as yards, you would walk right into the lake, or at least across Lincoln Memorial Drive if you started southeast from the bridge.  But if you start at the beginning of the ravine west of the light house, and walk 100 yards, over rock and soil, it would put you just at the bridge.  I think you can see that very well when you look at it from
www.local.live.com
rotated with east being at the top of the map set to the Bird’s Eye view.  Perfect spot to hide a casque.  Yeah, i know, I have trouble getting the verse to do it too.  Just maybe you have to walk 100 paces to get to the bridge.
I keep thinking of paces as the steps walked off like during a duel.  10 paces, turn and shoot.  Pretty big steps.

Okay okay okay— first of all, Lincoln Memorial drive is a Freeway. One which could be said to have a passing reference to being ‘cast in copper,’ or greater if that’s what you want.  Secondly, Milwaukee Rhythms was what I meant about thirteen years–it’s only been in existence that long, and if you read the intial post I made about it, I said this.  Because of the reference to the Shabbat, one could ASSUME that a synagogue was meant, but Preiss was himself Jewish (which means he may have already known that phrase), so he may have used to the term to mean any of the MANY cathedrals, churches, synagogues, and temples that are in Milwaukee.  Incidentally, Amethyst, the birthstone for Feb. is worn by priests, and is said to represent spiritual peace.  Spiritual Peace for milwaukee, again, could mean any place of worship.  Lastly, would BP have known that the Grand Staircase looked like two inverted C’s from above?  Without Google earth, it’s hard to tell.  Not to mention, that from above there are way too many parks that have things that look like inverted C’s. Do I even have to mention that the Grand Entrance is on Lake Street?  I mean, the entrance to the park itself, not to do with the “Grand” part…  If you are certain of where it’s at, tell Shadowrunner to go dig it up…I believe he said he would be going to Milwaukee again this spring.  THEN tell me what it is or is not within feet of.

forest_blight

I made a map to help us all orient ourselves. It’s too big to post here in one piece, but the whole thing can be downloaded here:
http://www.geocities.com/quantpsy/trove/map_with_text.jpg
Beware that your browser will probably try to compress the image to fit on your monitor. Holding your pointer over the image for a few seconds should make an “expansion” icon appear.
Here are the important bits:
Does this agree with everyone’s ideas about what is where, and how to get there? I couldn’t pick out *precisely* where the important trees are. Can you help with that, stercox?

Let me bump relavant photos so no one gets lost….

forest_blight

Okay, here we go. Stercox, do these match your recollection?
The full map:
http://www.geocities.com/quantpsy/trove/map_with_text2.gif

another one.

Re: Milwaukee update
« Reply #223 on: July 21, 2007, 04:09:38 »
——————————————————————————–
hey all,
I have spent the last ten days bumming around Milwaukee and I spent a few days at Lake Park trying to figure out the path that the verse lays out.  Everytime I followed the verse I ended up at the same tree that FB and stercox dug at last year.  So needless to say I didn’t find it but I do have a few things to report.
First, I checked a bunch of different parks and saw absolutely no reason to believe that it is anywhere other than Lake Park.  I didn’t expect to but I thought I would be thorough.
Secondly, this is a minor point as it doesn’t change the location any, I don’t think that the two balls the woman in the image is juggling are lawnbowling balls.  I think they are golf tee markers on the golf course right next to the lawnbowling fields.  My rationale is a) the color is right and the same all the time while the only people I saw lawnbowling were using black balls b) tee markers would be there all the time whereas lawnbowling balls would only be there if someone was playing, and c) tee markers come in sets of two while lawnbowling balls come in sets of 3-4(I think)
Thirdly, I believe I found the culvert that is referred to in the lines:
PASS THE COMPASS AND REACH
THE FOOT OF THE CULVERT
BELOW THE BRIDGE
After climbing the grand staircase you have to cross the golf course in order to get to the stairs that lead down into ravine 1.  At first, I didn’t really like this because there is a far easier way to pass the compass.  You just stay on the path that leads around the golf course and pass the compass by crossing the lion’s head bridge.  However, from there there is no easy way to get down into the ravine and below the bridge.  It’s doable but you could easily fall and hurt yourself climbing down the steeps sides of the ravine.  So I’m sure that BP would have taken (and wanted us to take) the far safer way and cross the golf course and descend into ravine 1 via the stairs at the far end of the ravine.  Once down there just before you reach the lion’s head bridge you pass the compass.  You can’t see it from there and I don’t know whether or not you could see it from there in 1982 but you definitely pass it.  When you are under the lion’s head bridge you are standing on a wooden footbridge and holding up the far end of the wooden footbridge is a stonewall.  In that stone wall is the culvert.  It is an old clay pipe that is a drain or channel under the path(which is the definition of a culvert.)  It is actually below (in elevation) both bridges, the lion’s head bridge and the wooden footbridge.  It is not directly under either the lion’s head bridge or the wooden footbridge.  You would be about 4-5 feet past both bridges when you get to the culvert.  I did not see anything like that below the bridge in ravine 2.
If you then walk 100 paces from the culvert(and I took a pace to mean a slightly longer than usual step) you end up at the end of the ravine at the first young birch that shadowrunner has marked on his map.
Anyway, that is what I found.  I will probably be back there early next week and be there until the 31st or so if anybody wants to get together and do some searching.
digger7

forest_blight

Some maps from stercox. These clear things up a bit, and include corrections to my aerial view:

to explain diggers less steep route

Dig it up.

13 years old, klbt from fox? Huh?

Unknown

Unknown:
Dig it up.

Already tried – your turn!

Unknown

Unknown:
Verse 8:
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
At a distance in space

Here is Mitchell Hall, in Milwaukee.
http://www.uwm.edu/map/buildings/vt-mit-prof.html
It looks like it’s 3 stories high, and was named in honor of 3 people.

Unknown

Unknown:
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
On a proud, tall fifth
At its southern foot
The treasure waits.

Wonderstone originates from Africa (South Africa).
http://www.galleryofstone.com/stone_info/pages/wonderstone_info.htm
However, it is also found in the western U.S.
http://www.geocities.com/av_gem/Wonderstone.html
Could this part of the verse just refer to seeing the letters “S” or “A”? (South Africa — the COUNTRY of wonderstone’s hearth)

and the building houses the university’s Dept. of Africanology.
Would the casque be “buried” inside a building?  Walk the halls, find a clue?

You might wanna walk up those stairs a little further.
Also, that tree isn’t a birch…look again, it’s a white poplar.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/mixedmetaphor/5655726415/

Unknown

Unknown:
and at 100 paces ends up at a birch tree

Absolutely correct, if a “pace” is 10″, and that’s the first young birch. Even stair treads are wider than that. And that’s the best case scenario.

pacing down a staircase doesn’t make sense, he would have said step down as he did in Cleveland.

Right. That birch stump is VERY compelling (actually gives me a lot of hope)…but when I picture over “rock and soil”, it’s not a paved or even stone set of stairs. I think of a rocky path.

TJ,
Is this more like what you expected?

Deuce

The tree you have marked as 5 is where I dug. I took a “pace” as 36 inches. Across the street is where it took me. I then remembered a conversation I had with the Lake Park Friends. When asking for permission to dig there they said not in the park but the beach side of the street was fair game. So when my paces took me there I thought maybe Preiss knew that as well. So I looked at the trees there and came across that one. I also thought, like rookhunter, there may have been trees removed and this might be our “fifth”. Then I saw the tree up close and thought it looked familiar. That’s why I dug there.

Ah ok I thought it was the one right  in front of where the group dug. Looks like erosion is taking its toll on that part of the park. At this point I would dig on the southern foot of every tree that looked like the one in the cape.

rookhunter

which Proud 5th? Well it is a tree that is obvious

I agree with Erexere…could be a tree, but I think it was deliberately left ambiguous.

This is probably nothing more than a very strange coincidence, but in 1962, Alfred Bader began operating an art gallery in Milwaukee’s Astor Hotel, and the current gallery shows a painting called “Woman Playing Harpsichord” by Wijbrand Hendricks.  Could the painting have been there in the early 80s?  Intriguing, eh?
But wait, there’s more.  From the July 14, 2005 issue of the Wisconsin Jewish Chronicle:  “Bader and his second wife, Isabel, live in the same home that he purchased in 1957 for $27,500. Bader originally selected the location because it was close to Congregation Emanu-El B’ne Jeshurun, where he taught Sunday school for more than 30 years.”
So where is this home?  An address search shows it at 2961 N Shephard Avenue.  In other words, between Mitchell Hall and Lake Park.
Was the painting in Bader’s home in the early 1980’s?
Drew

Boy, it is a shame that this monument is located in Washington Park on the opposite side of the city from Lake Park:
http://jamrent.50megs.com/finn/statue.htm
If you click on the picture of Steuben’s statue, you’ll see two of the statue’s plaques containing letters of correspondence between Steuben and George Washington.  Even though the first letter was written while Steuben was in the United States at the time, this is exactly the kind of thing I had envisioned for this verse regarding the “letter from the country” line.  If this verse truly does match Image 10, then I believe the wonderstone’s hearth would be Germany and may be found near a statue or monument with similar traits.

A friend of mine in Wisconsin is not very far from Milwaukee.  She is willing to make a trip for us and take some pictures (and count all those steps!), but she is not free to do so until early next week.

Pictures really help us out–that would be great Cat. Thank her for all of us.

“At a distance IN TIME / From three who lived there”
Are there any graves (monumental burials) in the park?
“At a distance IN SPACE / From woman with harpsichord /
Silently playing”
Is there such a statue or picture or frieze near, but not there?

I cant wait to see your friends pix cat… they sure do help a lot, by either confirming ideas we have or discounting them.  Keep us posted Cat….  could we be nearing the 3rd find?
I really like the “grand 200” (CC) idea.
……………..

I was typing Kenwood Blvd into Google Maps and it pre-empted with Mitchell Hall!
http://goo.gl/maps/kHNhP

Unless you are just having fun with ideas…isn’t it like re-inventing the wheel to offer more possible meanings
for “the beating of the world” other than Kenwood Blvd.?
AP

I second that conclusion, though the iconic path concept was pretty darn cool at the time.

no worries, your mileage may vary.

Awilson

Sorry that makes no sense everything about lake park is the ideal place the water tower is not a park ?? where is it on the painting ? it should have atleast 3 or more clues to get you to that place c’mon

I’m not sure where you got those rules but the multitude of clues and how I deciphered them got me to my dig spot. Now, maybe Lake Park is ideal for your solve but not for mine. And just so you know, the Water Tower is in an area referred to as Water Tower Park.
Josh recently jumped on board with my Water Tower solve but many, many people haven’t. That’s what’s so cool about these puzzles, we are all right until we’re not.

erexere

Proud…to have received an award, a medal, a rank that recognizes your achievement or success.
Tall…everyone around you is short because you have a nice plinth on which to stand, or you are sitting on a horse, or you’re just freakishly tall.
Fifth…5 somethings.

So… five star general?

It’s uncertain and only somewhat reasonable based on Chicagon and Cleveland summaries to say we know how any of the other puzzles work.
It’s hard to say you have a certainty in a match for any clue when the verse is stripped down quasi-generic representation or idea that might apply anywhere.
We tend to get self indulgent about what we expect makes a good puzzle or ideal hiding place. If Cleveland or Chicago are any kind of model for specificity, then some to the places in Lake Park do make great sense. The problem I have in MKE is the semi-certain fix on Downtown, leading towards Solomon Juneau doesn’t compel me to consider going North to Lake, which is a distant leap, any more than going South by the same distance. Theresa lot of things which can point to two or three different places, and in combination we would hope that helps us fine tune our direction. It’s a weird journey where Lincoln would be a good fit, but after that we still have juggling/wrestling ahead of us to decide what makes the best sense forna dig instruction like “at the end of ten by thirteen” or “beneath the tenth stone”.

Unknown

Unknown:
If Cleveland or Chicago are any kind of model for specificity, then some to the places in Lake Park do make great sense.

If MKE worked like Chicago, then the Treasure Ground should be at the base of the ravine below the Lighthouse. That is the most obvious, logical, and consistent destination once you “pass the compass”. The fact that nothing has been found there to date (and more than likely it’s because there was nothing there to find) should tell you all you need to know about Chicago as a “model of specificity”.
By the by, Roanoke (another path puzzle) works (or doesn’t work as the case may be) in almost exactly the same manner.

Not sure Preiss would have found a 5 Star general standing in the woods on the side of a road in which to bury a casque under his foot….but it was the late 70’s

Euhirudinea

If MKE worked like Chicago, then the Treasure Ground should be at the base of the ravine below the Lighthouse. That is the most obvious, logical, and consistent destination once you “pass the compass”. The fact that nothing has been found there to date (and more than likely it’s because there was nothing there to find) should tell you all you need to know about Chicago as a “model of specificity”.
By the by, Roanoke (another path puzzle) works (or doesn’t work as the case may be) in almost exactly the same manner.

Roanoke’s path is Weird in that the path starts with the first line of the verse and then goes to the image (roanoke by the window) , as opposed to chicago which starts at the water tower, an image in the picture and then goes to the first line of the verse.

MrBackstop

From the viewpoint you attached, the casque should be next to the Water Tower at bottom left which is the Southern point. The fencing is now out of the way since the landscaping was cleaned up.
As far as getting here, I started in the middle of the verse from where so many people kept getting to, the Lighthouse. So much solid research had already been completed over the years that it made sense to me to go from here.
Once I went passed the Lighthouse, down to the ravine and went the 100 steps SE, I realized two things. First BP would be referring to a Birch tree and secondly, “pass three” did not mean three Birch trees, but the Par 3 golf course in the park above.
The key to me was the phrase “staying west”. As you continue down the sidewalk on Lincoln you are staying to the west of those 100 steps you took to get to the first young birch. I just kept going in that direction until something in the distance stood out, the Northpoint Water Tower.
At this point I was to the west of the first young birch and passed the Par 3 golf course (red balls in image artwork).
The stone work of this tower is incredible and once I researched how the historic water towers worked I realized the hearth is part of it…..wonderstone’s hearth.
Now we just need melted snow, thawed ground and a little luck.

Not sure I can, just yet, buy into Priess leading us through parts of Milwaukee into Lakes Park, just to have us walk out of it and down the road several miles to the water tower. Is the millstone along that path walking away from Lake Park? What was at the end of the Locoust ravine where it meets N. Lincoln Memorial Dr.?

Unknown

Unknown:
Roanoke’s path is Weird in that the path starts with the first line of the verse

Are you talking about the Iconic to Park Path, or the path you are meant to travel on foot? Because the former is pretty much useless in MKE with regard to identifying the Park.

Euhirudinea

Are you talking about the Iconic to Park Path, or the path you are meant to travel on foot? Because the former is pretty much useless in MKE with regard to identifying the Park.

Iconic to path park.. Unless you go city hall to locust dr.

Sorry that makes no sense everything about lake park is the ideal place the water tower is not a park ?? where is it on the painting ? it should have atleast 3 or more clues to get you to that place c’mon

Unknown

Unknown:
Unless you go city hall to locust dr.

By the same methodology, you can go from City Hall to at least a half-dozen parks and green spaces in MKE. And it gets even less definitive in cities like New Orleans or San Francisco, where seemingly no park is eliminated by the process. You are welcome to draw your own conclusions, but I concluded a while back that Iconic to Park Path is not the process Preiss intended for us to use to identify the park with the certainty the puzzle requires. It’s just another thing to argue about.

Here are some photos from my recent (brief) trip to Milwaukee, to give people a feel for what it is like on the ground:
http://kspot.org/trove/lakepark/lakepark.htm

The bridge north of bistro has a pattern on diagonal that matches in similarity to the womans collar.

Sorry erexere, I’m not seeing it. I don’t think it’s a match.

Nice find WR!
Regarding paces… if a pace is two steps, 100 paces would put us across Lincoln Memorial Drive, regardless of which ravine is chosen.

Pass the compass has me convinced it applies to something named North Point.  The light house, the water tower, or the neighborhood natmed North Point are the main options.  If one line takes us that far in distance from the Grand Stair, it might only need another 7 or 8 lines to get us to Kosciuszko Park.
Another thing, Proud tall fifth certainly has our minds on looking for the fifth thing among a set of somethings, e.g. birch trees, lion statues, etc., but nobody seems to recognize the solid possibility of a 1-star General aka Brigadier General as a fifth, since the rank of General maxes at 5-stars.  1 of 5 or 1/5 is commonly known as a fifth as well.

Just ruminating on the word “pace”…
pace/pās/
Noun:
A single step taken when walking or running
.
It is 100 “steps” from just below the bridge
to the end of the North Lion Bridge Ravine.
Coincidence?
AP

…does that get you to the junction with Lincoln…? Am I right in thinking that you’d only “pass the compass” to get below the north ravine bridge by passing it on the way north to the other end…? And that 100 paces southeast from a point below the bridge over the south ravine would take you over the road…?
I just put a note about this quest on a metal detecting forum, and within minutes someone replied that it was one of the most interesting posts they’d ever read. You know, y’all could learn a lot from that bunch…

animal painter

Just ruminating on the word “pace”…
pace/pās/
Noun:
A single step taken when walking or running
.
It is 100 “steps” from just below the bridge
to the end of the North Lion Bridge Ravine.
Coincidence?
AP

Unknown

Unknown:
Quote from: animal painter on May 30, 2012, 10:16:48 pm
cw0909,
I always assumed that a pace is one “walking step” or stride. (I could be wrong.)
If you use 2 steps for a pace, that makes the Milwaukee clue entirely different.
AP
(I like your illustration… )

bringing this from v2
how much dif do you think,maybe 2Xs what you had b4
i did my driveway my measure was 23 1/2 paces,the 2 foot fall
count and going with the 5ft,117.5 ft, taped measured 118ft
and i walk with a slight limp,left leg

You know AP, perhaps the proud tall fifth is the largest and/or oldest chestnut tree in the park.  With all your contacts there, maybe a simple inquery about it could solve this thing for you (and us).

Walk 100 paces
I really have to remember that this doesn’t tell us which direction.  Just because the next line is “Southeast over rock and soil”, that doesn’t mean we walk 100 paces southeast.
I’m going to go over my notes again and consider what new points of interest pop up if we consider 360 degrees of travel from where spots “below the bridge” leave us.

Have you seen the hi-res bird’s eye view of the lighthouse and bridges from Microsoft Bing Maps 3D?

Thanks wk, that’s a great resource.  🙂
At a quick glance, the street-level mapping doesn’t seem as comprehensive, but it offers useful alternative aerial views of these locations, as well as ground-level in some cases. Do they use a different satellite or something?
I’m installing Ovi as well now. You’ve opened my eyes to a whole new world of mapping. This is going to waste even more of my time.

I’ve previously looked for the distinctive shape of the lion bridge in image 10, and this one suddenly jumped out at me. Can’t remember if it’s been mentioned before. The three prongs at either end match the pattern in the cloak and fingers, with the arm as the path.
The edge of the cloak would be the ravine.
I haven’t given up hope of using an image as a map at some point.
*** Brainstorming ***
The coppery edge of the collar is linked with the copper sign of the Pabst theatre, and with Lincoln Memorial Drive which is also “cast in copper”. That might put the gem in the area at the south end of one of the ravines before the turning. I previously suggested a 5 in the crook of the juggler’s elbow, and that’s right in the middle of this bridge shape, so I’m inclined to think of the bridge and its pride as the 5th. That would mean the location is not necessarily beside a birch.
So…if it can’t be found by following the instructions literally and looking for a specific tree, how do you find it? Would have to be from some missing pictorial clue. For instance, Sonoran seemed to be wandering around this kind of scenery in that general area, though I’m not sure exactly where this is. There are elements in the image that remind me of steps. (I’m not suggesting there’s a match here; it’s just a random example of the way in which it might conceivably work. I’m not convinced the verses are always enough to get you to the exact spot. Also wondering about waits/weights/waist as a final pointer.)
I see it something like this:
The lion bridge shape fits the south ravine best, being the left sleeve from this angle. The left edge of the cloak is the south trail (dotted line) down to Lincoln, the curving copper band.
Ideally someone could find a millstone or something lying around in the circled area where the amethyst is.  😉 I don’t know what this area looks like…would be interested to see some pics.
Another shape that might be worth considering is the gem; eg, an open area with steps in one corner or something.
On the other hand, the scale might be completely different, putting it right next to a “prong”. In fact I like that better.
Ie, here:
What does that look like on the ground…?
(Then again, the casque might be represented by the red ball between the two prongs opposite, at the other end of this bridge.)

AP,
those are great pictures!
how long before things defrost up there?
i hope you have one of those poking things that others have used.  if you do poke around the lions, don’t poke  past the 5th columns on the bridges,
from either end or side
are they called south and north lion bridges?

i thought it was an unwritten rule (i read this somewhere) that if you wrote a treasure hunt and used the word “pace” that somewhere you had to specify exactly how far it was.  does anyone know if BP did this in the book anywhere? myself, i find it interesting that the lighthouse was moved exactly “100 feet east” from where it first stood.
http://flickr.com/photos/10751862@N04/1 … otostream/
boogieman i thought the whole point was for everyone to give their ideas and the hunters might get ideas from something we might say…that’s what i’m hoping, that something i say might help. i would love to find the very thing someone needed to go find the casque, like johanns did..wasn’t it johanns that found the names that pointed to the cleveland park? that would be such a cool thing. i wanna be a johanns

wow, i just looked up the word “fifth” in the thesaurus, and it’s strange, look:
Roget’s New Millennium™ Thesaurus – Cite This Source – Share This
Main Entry:  enemy
Part of Speech:  noun
Definition:  foe
Synonyms:  adversary, agent, antagonist, archenemy, asperser, assailant, assassin, attacker, backbiter, bad guy, bandit, betrayer, calumniator, competitor, contender, criminal, crip, defamer, defiler, detractor, disputant, emulator, falsifier, fifth column*, foe, guerrilla, informer, inquisitor, invader, meat, murderer, opponent, opposition, other side*, prosecutor, rebel, revolutionary, rival, saboteur, seditionist, slanderer, spy, terrorist, traducer, traitor, vilifier, villain
Antonyms:  ally, benefactor, friend, supporter,
i like “other side”, “fifth column”….but is there some bandit in lake park?
i’d of never thought of these meanings
the dictionary mentioned the gear shift also,  shseverin, your mentioning that made me look it up.

Slappy,
Spring thaw is about a month away, if we are lucky…
By May, for sure. (leaves show up about the second
week in May.)
I called them North and South bridge, only for the purpose
of identification.
Where do you see the profile of the Lion at the end of the
cape?
AP

Hmmmm…..okay, that worked!—assuming that perhaps it IS one of the bridges…
Then the “letter from wonderstone’s hearth” is the next puzzle. If “wonderstone” is amethyst, and amethyst is German, then a “German letter” is what you are looking for. The only distinctive German letter I know of is:
ß called es-zett or scharfes S (sharp s)
which looks like two cursive f’s together.
A decorative element could conceivably have this shape, such as a double-scroll on the end of a railing or something like that.
I also thought about
two lions
=
two lines
= L or T or X, etc… (made of two lines) but I do not think Preiss would have been that obscure. It’s not as strong a connection to me, anyway. All of the letters made with two lines could be used as part of structures, yet somehow I’m just not convinced that’s what it means.
The knothole was a great idea–yet I wonder if it was there or as distinctive 30 years ago. Ditto for the G.

Slappy, Boogie and Shecrab,
I am open to the idea that the Proud Tall Fifth could be one of the
bridges in Lake Park.  So, thinking in that direction, I went back
to photos of the bases of the two Lion Bridges.
If we thought it was challenging to find a plexiglas box at the
foot of a tree…then looking at the foot of a bridge is a
“monumental” endeavor. These bridges are at least 20 ft. wide…
If you “
pass the compass and reach the foot of the culvert
“, you
could be under either the South Lion Bridge or the North Lion Bridge…
depending on which trail you took.  You have to pass the lighthouse
to get to the West end (beginning) of either trail.
Below the bridge, walk 100 paces Southeast over rock and soil
I know that it is 100 normal steps from below the North Lion bridge
to the East end of the Northern Ravine trail.  It takes you in a Southeasterly
direction and it is over steps made of rocks separated by dirt
The distance from the South Lion Bridge to the East end of the
South Ravine trail, is not quite 100 normal steps.
It also goes in a Southeasterly direction, but the steps are made of
wooden timbers separated by dirt.
If you look for a
young birch
at the end of either trail, it appears that the
Northern Ravine trail has a tree about the right age and is “brichy” looking.
The Southern Ravine trail may have had a young birch at some time, but it
is not obviously visible now.
Here comes the tricky part….
Pass three, staying west
1.  If you head West from the Southern Ravine exit, you would be
headed up a very wooded steep hill to get up to the Southern end of
the South Lion Bridge. (I do not know if it would be considered the foot.)
If you stay on the West…or left side of the grassy area at the end of the
Southern Ravine trail, moving Northeast, you would reach the
Northern Ravine trail exit…
There are 3 bridges from the Eastern end of the Northern Ravine trail
to the North Lion Bridge (taking you in a North
west
erly direction.
2. If you leave the Northern Ravine trail exit and stay West, it will take you
to the Southern Ravine trail exit…and West to the South Lion Bridge.
I do not think that there are any bridges on that South Ravine trail before
you get to the South Lion Bridge.
I have not seen any letters on either Lion bridge yet.
Here is the link to photos of the Lion Bridges/bases
http://tinyurl.com/3akr7k
They were taken last July.
They may seem confusing, but you can get the idea of what they look like.
From frozen (9 degrees) Milwaukee.
AP
Just for the record…BOTH trails, as of today…are solid ice…and could be
used for Olympic toboggan-runs!

AP, see where the cloak comes from her neck to our right? at the very end of the cloak, i guess i should have said a silhouette of the lion, the dark shadow at the very end of the cloak, underneath the blue part and to the right. the lions are so distinctive and i love their paws, so maybe i’m just imagining it. ( i tend to do that
) i don’t think it matches the coast line, do you? or .. do you?

She,
The knothole looks like it is old enough to have been
there in 1982.
Another thing is the multi-trunk tree.
Why put a painting of that in the image
if you do not go in that direction or even
see it…when you’re stopping at the bridges…
As for a letter on the bridge…the “X” cross brace was
immediately evident.
Slappy,
I will have to take a closer look at the cape and
get back to you. Thanks for the ideas…
AP

Unknown

Unknown:
Another thing is the multi-trunk tree.
Why put a painting of that in the image
if you do not go in that direction or even
see it…when you’re stopping at the bridges…

True enough, yet JPP put the image of the fountain in the Cleveland painting twice, yet it was only peripherally involved in the solution–viz., letting you know you were in the right area. So no doubt it
is
important to identifying the area, but how involved is it in the actual casque location? Dunno.
Another interp of “letter from Wonderstone’s hearth”– W O N D E R S T O N E S H E A R T H —could be any of these letters. Shades of “Mad Mad Mad MAd world” and the giant W?  or maybe
W on der Stone’s Heart H?
Just brainstorming.

She,
You, and other recent posters, definitely bring
many new ideas to this “table”.
Thanks

KLBT,
I just put three photos of the area of Ravine Rd and LMD
on the webshots album…at:
http://tinyurl.com/3akr7k
It was getting dark when I took them, so they are not
as detailed as they should be. I can go back this weekend.
What leads you to this area?
I see a tree at the left that has a somewhat similar configuration
to the tree in the cape.
AP

Huh… I never noticed that…  No, nothing special about it… It’s just that in all of the places people have suggested to dig, it’s the only one nearby that has flat ground, no root systems (except that bush), is on LMD, and is behind something large and proliferate.

I just made an album of close-up photos of the two
Lion pedestal bases on the Southern bridge by the
cape-tree.
Any comments, opinions or observations are welcome.
In the photos, I refer to the “West Base” as the
Lion base nearest the cape-tree…It is the most
westerly of the two bases.  The “East Base” is the
companion base which is the more “south-easterly”
of the two bases.
When BP guided us with the
100 paces
he used
an exact direction…
Southeas
t
…as if he had a
compass with him.  If that is the case, then when he
said the treasure was waiting at the
southern foot
,
he probably had his compass out and was trying to be
just as exact.
AP
Here is the link to webshots:
http://tinyurl.com/3ylmxw

Looks terrific!
Looks like no matter how you slice it, there will be some heavy tree roots to deal with, unless you don’t stay west and dig on the east side of the base.  Along with a shovel, you may need a small hand saw or a sharp small axe.

It’s “Good Friday”, and in Milwaukee, it is snowing…again.
Forecast is for 6 inches…snowing until 10:00 tonight…
then again on Easter Sunday.
This effectively puts the Kai-Bosch on my searching,
probing or digging at Lake Park this weekend
I did go to the park for an hour yesterday to take
another look at the trees in the South Ravine,
(still not completely convinced about the
letter from the country of wonderstone’s
hearth on a proud tall fifth
being an “m” on the
bridge framework. )
I scrutinized every existing tree on either side of the ravine,
looking for “a letter” of any sort….no luck….but
I did find a tree that had succumbed to the the ravages
of this Milwaukee winter and had fallen across the Ravine trail.
AP
Good Friday update…Noon:
(Forget the 6-inches of snow forecast…we have already
received 12 inches in 5 hours…with 10 hours left to snow!
Lake Park will be under snow for a loooong time!)
3:00 update:
The snow is now over my knees!…at least 20″

Yeah. Harpsichord music.

wow, good to see some progress here!  I haven’t checked in lately because I don’t live near Milwaukee anymore
I’ll still try to help out from here

Please be merciful if this has been mentioned before.  What about the other possible meanings of the noun “compass”?  a circumference or boundary; an area, extent, scope; the range of tones of a voice or musical instrument (Oxford Dictionary)

Some maps from stercox. These clear things up a bit, and include corrections to my aerial view:

well, it does appear that the casque is by a tree. I had ruled out some locations in the zoo because I found that hard to deal with. I guess I’ll have more work to do with the bulldozer…
wilhouse

sorry, but i have to ask: How you know it’s the 5th tree going NW and not the 5th tree going SE?  Couldn’t you pass the “north point compass” from either ravine?  And isn’t the 2nd ravine more southeast?  If you don’t find the treasure at the NW tree, consider digging under the SE tree in the row of five as well, just in case.

Stercox marked the 5th tree going SW – the map is rotated 90 degrees clockwise. But your point is well-taken. It could be either tree depending on which ravine you start from. Not having been there in person, it makes more sense to me to
Pass the compass
by simply traversing the Lion Bridge before then going down Ravine 2, which has the GS marker at one end.

johann

the range of tones of a voice or musical instrument (Oxford Dictionary)

interesting idea Johann….that would tie into the aforementioned 5th as related to musical notes.
leaning towards the trees right now but if we come up empty there…music may need to be researched.

Aha…I see what you mean now “Ascend the 92 steps(…pause for effect…) After climbing the grand 200”
Now, if that is the case (which I must say makes a lot of sense) why or what is the 200?  Let us suppose that there are actually 92 steps leading up the staircase……are there 92 steps leading down the other side? (stairway is in 2 arched sections). Or are there more steps on one side than the other?  92+92 = quite close to 200
yes indeed, i like it a lot…let’s find this one Varin

I am sure you have done this several times before but you should try following the verse from begining to end and see the location you end up.
What we need and I do not know if it exists or if we could get one is a metal detecter type of item that could penatrate the ground and show you what is under ground that is not metal.
Such a thing would be useful for here Houston and San Fransisco.

Scottrocks,
That was my thinking, too.
So I did just that.  Walked the whole path!
I have used a hobby-grade metal detector
(not ground penetrating radar)
as recently as last weekend.  It goes off at
the base of almost every potential tree….
So I dug 6-inch diameter holes by 3 different
trees….I dug until I hit stone…
I believe the only way to be more definite in
digging is to find photos that showed what
BP saw.  That is why I am pursuing the Girl
Scouts Leaders and hopefully their personal
photo albums.
Thanks for your input!
AP

Egbert’s popcorn…

yes I know…..we really have to find another casque to start narrowing our list or else find another almost concrete theory (which I believe Houston to be).
Are there any other famous Mitchells that have either written 3 known stories (margaret wrote more) or live in a very popular 3 story house?  Atlanta is still very high on my list for this one for the moment  😛

most probably meaningless but chapter 67 of
A Treatise of Human Nature
by the Scottish philosopher/historian David Hume speaks both of a distance in time and a distance in space.

Unknown

Unknown:
Wonderstone originates from Africa (South Africa).
http://www.galleryofstone.com/stone_info/pages/wonderstone_info.htm
However, it is also found in the western U.S.
http://www.geocities.com/av_gem/Wonderstone.html
Could this part of the verse just refer to seeing the letters “S” or “A”? (South Africa — the COUNTRY of wonderstone’s hearth)

That’s right.  This is one of my first posts on this thread:

I seem to remember that Wonderstone comes from south africa
http://www.giancarlostone.com/wonderstone.html
and also from Utah.
wilhouse.

Lots of stuff going on in this next photo and there’s probably lots missing.  I’ve tried to map instances where I think verse and image go with landmarks.
Yellow numbers go with the Picture
1. the city hall spires in background
1a. forgot to add in the blacksmith metal work that looks like the flower
2. the orbs as basketball references to the Mecca arena
3. Zeidler Union Park where doing perspective math to find angle and distance gets you
4. the line of the cloak along the back of woman’s head area matches blue shaded river area when rotated 90 deg.
5. the cloak tip matches this green shaded area near Northpoint park
6. the orange shaded river bank matches the forehead to chin profile of the woman who is now wearing pink lipstick
7. the pattern inside of the collar matches the area around statue in Koscuiszko Park
Red numbers go with Verse:
1. Mitchell Hall
2. Grand Stair
3. 100 paces south east
4. Letter from the country
5. Compass = North (lighthouse, park, or street)
6. hmm…oh, this was meant to go with the Image for the Art Museum
7. woman, with harpsichord
8. distance in time (second street)
9. nevermind
10. pass three stay west (from 2nd go past 3rd, 4th, and 5th to land on 6th)
11. step onto nature
12. proud tall fifth, statue of 1 star general
13. cast in copper (Lincoln Ave.)

WR, great stuff, I’m not sold on the helicopter, but I love the germanic link to wonderstone and heart+H, along with the cloak tip and blacksmith art.  I had been looking for a link to the word ‘epistle’ but havn’t found anything.  **edit: the epistolary form of writing would have to be well known by B.Preiss, as it was used in works like Clarissa by Samuel Richardson or Frankenstein by M. Shelly.  ‘Letter from the country’ just really grabbed me that way…still really like the H for hospital though, since etymologically speaking, the german word SPITAL is very similar to the word EPISTLE, if you wish to allow rearrangement to ESPITLE and S-PITLE = SPITAL, or HOSPITAL.  Whether or not the hospital sign was in place at the time in 1981 to see the specific letter ‘H’, the fact that there is a hospital there is the equivalent of a “letter from the country”.  A root meaning to do with the word ‘hosptial’ is ‘foreigner’ or ‘stranger’ and  that in German is ‘Ausslander’ which can be seen as “from the country”.  Sorry if I’m seem redundant or to be over thinking…just had my afternoon espresso.
I’m feeling good about the Kosciuszko statue for two reasons now that I’m inclined to scratch the wonderstone connection I tried to force with it.  1. Walkway layout matches collar pattern (not that the shape of collar doesn’t match something somewhere else as WR has suggested) and 2. 1/5th General.
At a distance in time = “second” or 2nd street as best I can tell and
At a distance in space = “state” as in a thermodynamic system where you consider variables like pressure, volume, etc… I derive this line of thinking from a number of ‘engineering’ related clues I’ve gathered from other possible casque solutions.  There always seemed to be a school of Engineering nearby or a reference to a person who was an engineer…like L. Ron Hubbard or S. Lancaster.  I suppose it all plays into the architectural themes.

animal painter

The collar design looks a lot like this park just down the street from the Northpoint Lighthouse.

Unknown

Unknown:
Colnik heard about the “German Athens” to the north, Milwaukee, and decided he could better earn a living with Milwaukee’s large German speaking communities. Colnik received several commissions from beer barons Captain Frederick Pabst and Herman Uihlein of Schlitz Brewing Company, among other “48ers” who had amassed fortunes since the German influx into America in 1848.
Colnik was a pacifist. When World War I broke out he became depressed. He heard of an English officer who saw atop the building of one of the largest German newspapers in Milwaukee a symbol of Germany’s greatest conquest: a statue of Miss Germania. The English wanted the statue removed. One night, Colnik helped remove Miss Germania from the building and concealed her in his shop so she would not be defaced or stolen. The statue has never been seen nor recovered since.

Pass three, staying west
If you interpret the 100 paces as leading back from the lion bridge to Lincoln Memorial Drive, one of the threes you pass heading west is a road sign.
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
“Hearth” always seemed a strange choice of word, and I’d wondered if it was a clue for the letter: “country of wonderstone’s heart – h”, H being at the heart of Deutschland and Amethyst.
A bit further on, you pass the “H” of the St Mary’s Hospital helipad.
The “beating of the whirled”…?
It’s near the collar-like North Point Park…
The helipad is at the tip of the cloak-like shape which rests on the collar in the image.
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
On a proud, tall fifth
At its southern foot
The treasure waits.
Maybe the letter isn’t actually on the fifth, and it means “onwards”, or something.
I like the idea of getting the collar-park onto the collar.
Perhaps there’s some connection between the character’s collar and the millstone which seems to be the focus of her attention.
If she’s looking at the hole in the middle of the millstone…and we’re looking for the hole in the middle of the collar…then based on the cloak analogy that would be somewhere round here…
The lines indicate the area I associate with the cloak tip on the collar, containing the helipad. I’ve circled the
Villa Terrace Decorative Arts Museum
.
It features displays by Austrian master blacksmith
Cyril Colnik
.

From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
This is Jean Atkinson in a historic photo at the Volunteer Services for the Visually Impaired organization that shares the Milwaukee Public Library building.  Now it is known as ABLE or Audio & Braille Literary Enhancement.  The “silently playing” has either to do with a statue or some element of imagery or possibly a deafness motif, which is often seen paired with the blindness disability.  Why do people tend to speak loudly when talking to a person with visual disability?  I’ve paired her photo with a historic painting of a woman playing a Virginal type harpsichord.

BP just said it wasn’t in central park
not that it wasn’t near central park

another possible NY connection
From woman, with harpsichord Silently playing….
at the Metropolitan Museum of Art is this famous piece:
http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/todi/hd_todi.htm
which unfortunatley puts us right back to the outskirts of Central Park.  ;D

Deuce

When I go up there I won’t have a ton of time to try out every single idea.

Planning a trip then? That would be great. Incidentally apart from the Image 10 and Verse 8 threads, there’s quite a few posts in this one in case you missed it.
http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/i … pic=3000.0
There’s also a bunch of other short Milwaukee threads.
http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/i … pic=4652.0
http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/i … pic=4657.0
http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/i … pic=4947.0
http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/i … pic=5361.0
http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/i … pic=5555.0
While I agree with Juneau as a possible fifth, I still think “its southern foot” may refer to the park rather than the statue. The only pic of this area I’ve ever seen is in this PDF about the “pollinator garden”.
http://www.fs.fed.us/wildflowers/pollin … Report.pdf
(This is also quite close to the Art Museum if that’s where the harpsichordist was.)

Merlot,
I have never seen that rectangular shape on Ellis Island presented before!
That is quite an eye opener!
AP

Merlot Brougham

And despite popular opinion, The NY box puzzle screams of Ellis Island, no? I know that goes against the popular theory of self-appointed rule makers who decree there is no way possible the cask was ever buried on Ellis Island, but all the clues are there:

I agree that Image 12 screams Ellis Island, but as I recall, there is no verse that even comes close to describing Ellis Island.
This should really go on the Image 12 thread, btw.

Egbert

This should really go on the Image 12 thread, btw.

Sure thing, coach

Euhirudinea

I also think New York and New Orleans are box puzzles.[

And despite popular opinion, The NY box puzzle screams of Ellis Island, no? I know that goes against the popular theory of self-appointed rule makers who decree there is no way possible the cask was ever buried on Ellis Island, but all the clues are there:
You see how the shadow exactly matches the real statue of Liberty? The sun shines in certain directions and only casts that specific shadow on the Statue of Liberty, so although there is a replica Statue of Liberty in Monkeys Eyebrow, Kentucky and this image of the Statue of Liberty is “obviously” a red herring *wokka wokka wokka*. The treasure is in Kentucky and not New York, guys. Because the author that was worried about everything being found too quickly planted a false image of the statue of Liberty. Jesus Christ….
And no, I don’t think the Spires are intended to be some random Russian Orthodox Church deep in the heart of Queens, I think they are the spires of Ellis Island.
It’s 1982. Bryon Preiss gives you an exact match of the birds on the Ferry Building terminal on Ellis Island that several people missed on their trips to Ellis Island. Must mean it’s buried at Fort Hamilton, or somewhere on Staten Island, right? I don’t buy it.

decibalnyc

…just trying to get people to start offering suggestions as to what that 200 is for…what else could it be…other opinions?

The bicentennial?
https://www.trails.com/tcatalog_trail.a … BGM049-039
Is there a trail there (or possible sign that used to be there), that could physically tie into the path/progression of clues?
Although I don’t know if you can “climb” the grand 200 if it is a trail there…never been there.

TJ,
Here is the big problem with the trail.
Coming from your start, down wells to the Juneau statue match, is where you can pick up the O.L.T., it runs paralell to LMD (Step on nature / Cast in copper) and only goes one way as it starts at the south end of Juneau park on the west side of the st. Keep in mind that on the LAKE SIDE of LMD is the continuation of the oak leaf trail from the south side of town, and this runs the course of the lakeshore all the way to whitefish bay and beyond, you would have no reason to cross the street tho, you pick up the trail in Juneau Park and take it from there.
The trail you pick up at the Juneau statue, splits off at McKinley Park and takes you to Gordon Park, along the Milwaukee River…which also has stairs and interesting things to look at. At McKinley park however you can continue along the sidewalk (which was the Oak Leaf Trail prior to the intersection) and walk LMD for a few blocks and the trail meets up with it again at the water tower. Keep on walking and you’re going to see the grand staircase.
The only signage we have to look at when we get to the stairs… (click on picture and you’ll see, the Lake Park Sign, the Street signs calling out Lincoln, and Ravine rd. and a locust st trail sign which wasn’t there in 81, and the stone)
At the top of the stairs there is far less…like nothing, so our only instruction is 200, and there is nothing written up there. There are the 2 light posts at the top which I took pictures of a few years back for Oregonian. There were electrical taps on the front of the light posts facing the stairs covered by metal panels. The panel on the SOUTH side of the stairs has a masons compass on it, but the panels don’t look like they are 35yrs old at all. Oregonian took this find, and reversed it to say the panel was on the NORTH side light to shoehorn his solve at the bottom of Ravine Rd. There’s still no posted solution that can be agreed upon, on this forum, in regards to the 200.

Just to show you, this is the south side
And here is the North Side
I did notice a small plaque on the stairs in the above picture, I remember checking it out when I took the photo, and I believe it had a dedication date of 1996, but I’ll check again.
I just wanted to post this to show that the one plate remaining is in fact on the south side, and not the north as Oregonian would have you believe from his solution on the Wiki.
I think it’s safe to say that at one point, those masons compass’ were on both sides of the stairs. They probably needed to tap into the light and lost the plate, OR someone stole it as a keepsake, or whatever. I have heard that the lightposts have always been marked with that symbol, but I couldn’t get a date verification when I asked. AND before we can pass the compass (which if we interpret it as this, would have been on both sides, or only the south side of the stairs if they were still there) we still have…. 200

Glossiphoniidae

Well, I have also been looking for this because I haven’t been convinced about the Olmsted significance (that dude was everywhere). I’ve been looking at BP making stops at the local art museums, which Chicago seemed to point out, and I’ve had some great success. I haven’t shared this before because I have been working on it’s significance. I’ll let you all find others (I’ll share a couple good ones, IMO), but here’s four to peak your interest…
The Chicago image utilized the Great Lakes Fountain.
The Cleveland image utilized the Man and Horse Armour.
The Charleston image utilized the Persephone Fountain.
The Boston image utilized the Horus Falcon (Horace
).
Interestingly, BP also seemed to rely on a work of art featured in some museums, too.

Yes. Yes. I think this is prime source material for one of the “prongs” if you will, of the puzzles for each location. Local museums, art galleries, and cultural gardens…all within a “vicinity” of the burial location.

While we won’t know for absolute until we dig up a few more, we have more than enough circumstantial evidence to pinpoint the general location of at least 3 casques in addition to the 2 that we already have out of the ground: Houston, Milwaukee, and Roanoke. Xiesih claims that he has the definitive solution to the Boston puzzle, so perhaps we can add that one to the list once he is ready to share his ideas publicly. That’s six of twelve and if we add FOY, which also seems pretty solid, we have over half of the puzzle solved.
Of the puzzles mentioned above, four fit the Chicago pattern (a walk [or ride] that takes you from Point A to Point T) and only one (FOY) that fits the Cleveland pattern (a fairly detailed description of the general area surrounding the treasure ground). Intuitively, this makes sense since we have to accept that in most cases, the treasure ground has probably changed significantly in the 33 years since Preiss buried the casques. The verses that focus on the treasure ground are therefore harder to decipher today for all those changes.
As for an all encompassing unifying theme, I’m not sure it exists beyond what we have already discovered. Preiss probably had his routine as he traveled the country, and probably stuck to it as much as possible from city to city. And if it lead him to a suitable place to bury the casque, so much the better. But he probably had to make a fair amount of decisions on the fly (ground conditions, weather, prying eyes, information after the fact, etc.), since I don’t believe he scouted all twelve locations in advance. IOW, I believe Preiss was flexible and we should be as well.
Let me ask this question: Where would you bury the casque in Lake Park?

Unknown

Unknown:
I think the beginning of the verse could be figured out, but it’s not crucial to solving it. Thoughts?

Solving the first part of this verse isn’t necessary to find the treasure in Milwaukee, but could prove to be useful for the other solves.
As for the “proud tall fifth”, if the “first” is a tree, and “three” are also trees, then it makes sense that “fifth” is a tree as well. Besides, unless things have changed significantly in that area (and historical photos seem to suggest that is not the case), what else in the immediate area is both “proud” and “tall”? There’s a grown-up in Milwaukee that used to be a kid with a pen knife that need to come clean.

Renovator, I was wondering how long you’ve been working on these puzzles? I’ve been at it for a
3.5 years. Its amazing how even now, new ideas seem to be popping up to keep it interesting. This hunt has definitely been warming up and I believe more help from folks like yourself will help recover a casque someday soon.

Unknown

Unknown:
Renovator, I was wondering how long you’ve been working on these puzzles?

Unknown

Unknown:
This hunt has definitely been warming up and I believe more help from folks like yourself will help recover a casque someday soon.

For about 5 years now. But since I am at least 5 hours from the nearest treasure ground, and don’t travel for work, I’ve never really given much thought to actually digging one of these things up. And it’s only been recently that I thought that what I have learned from following the forum might be useful to the people who are actually willing to do the shovel work. Which is why I am more fully involved now.
That is kind of you to say. I certainly hope that will be the case.

Euhirudinea

As for the “proud tall fifth”, if the “first” is a tree, and “three” are also trees, then it makes sense that “fifth” is a tree as well.

This is one subject I would like to debate. I don’t think the “proud tall fifth” is a 100% tree. I’m not ruling it out, or anything for that matter, but we should consider it could be something else.
If you look at the verse that line is disconnected from the 2 instructions that we suspect involves trees. Because he makes the comment “you’ll see a letter from the country of wonderstones hearth,” This seems to signify something a little more than “here’s a young birch” and “pass 3 more of them.” Also BP was a knowledgeable person, I have some doubts as to weather he would put the actual casque next to a tree, unless there was another significant structure there. He would have seen the erosion problem, it was actually worse in 1981. I think there are still more options for our “fifth” besides a tree (no pun intended).
I now know that BP at least had a general understanding of trees, so I believe an old photo will show a birch tree at the end of the north ravine. I also have expectations that we may uncover 3 more birch trees giving us a direction of travel. Depending on which way (north or south) we are directed to go from the ravine will give us more insight to what the “fifth” might be. It could be a tree, but I feel it could be a little more than that.
Also, I would debate (on a separate issue) that BP did scout out all of these locations and I think he used ariel maps based on some of the clues in the image. He must have taken the time to visit downtown where city hall is and to learn about Downer, Shepherd, and Hackett for the verse…he didn’t google any of this stuff, so I would guess he did some research. Also I don’t think he would just go hiking with a casque a polaroid and a shovel looking for a good spot, he would have the spot already picked out and would probably drive there and park somewhat near the burial site.
Please lets open this up for debate though, that is how we learn and advance!

What about proximity to college campus’ ?

Actually getting off topic with this…interesting and valid conversation, but I think it’s for a different thread.
I have it on good authority from someone close to BP that he did have some knowledge of trees, and I believe he would have known a birch tree from any other in the woods. There was some question as to weather he knew his trees or not, I would say he did. We are defiantly looking for a photo from the 80’s with a birch tree at the end of the north ravine. We could also hope to find 2 or 3 in a line either to the north or south of the ravine, telling us where to go. I doubt that the “proud tall fifth” is a tree, but for now we need to verify the birch at the end of the north ravine.
Those who follow the Lake Park solution, are we all in agreement that the verse is pretty clear from the top of the staircase to the bottom of the north ravine?
After climbing the grand 200
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young birch
I think the beginning of the verse could be figured out, but it’s not crucial to solving it.
Thoughts?

1852 was the year of founding for both Wells Fargo and the the Layton and Plankington Packing Co.

In the interest of getting some discussion going, I am going to post a few things that have been rattling in my brain. This is not to say I know any more than any of you, or have inside information, but the more people looking at this the better I think. I will be the first one to say that some of these ideas are a stretch, but if it sparks an idea in someone’s head.. excellent. So here it goes. Oh and before I start… another Facebook page has been started by a very nice young lady that is very interested in this as well and she has some good pics on there. Here is that link :
https://www.facebook.com/groups/923079167758839/
First and foremost, I always try to put myself in the other guys shoes. In this case Preiss and Palencar. They didn’t have the wonderful access to technology like we have today. So historical places, parks, fixtures, historical records and pictures, and aerial maps would be the only thing to go on. So I paid extra attention to each one of these. The Chicago and Cleveland treasures had the picture of where this thing was and while it’s not as nice as the others, Milwaukee’s is in there. So I am going to post a few things just to create some discussion.
First off the neck.
Going off the theory that Palencar and Preiss were looking at aerial views of things, this always seemed like the biggest hint. So I went looking. I came up with a few things here.
In earth view (not included sorry) this rounds off more because of the bushes that surround the fountain. When zoomed out, it somewhat resembles her neckline and around in the golden part of the inside of her hood. Here is that picture for reference.
​
Here is the park fountain to kind of demonstrate the cane shape at the end.
https://savral.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/img_8231.jpg
This is also next to the fountain.
https://savral.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/img_8228.jpg
​
Across the street from this is the North Point Water Tower. Fun fact : The top of it is “cast in copper”. Also has this on the side of it.
https://savral.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/img_8226.jpg
​
So why do I think any of this? To the north east of this spot is a huge staircase. This from what I can tell has 91 steps if I did it correctly. But that’s really all that fits. The copper top, the side brick.. I might be stretching but I am just bringing this stuff up to just shed light on stuff that might not have been seen or thought about or whatever.
Been staring at these maps for a long time as well. In regards to the neck, I suppose the spot between the two lions bridges kinda looks like it. Here they are : First 1980 (top view) Second : 2013 (Angle View)
I also put these pictures up, especially the first picture from 1980 because of the jutting out into the water. Palencar put stuff in his pictures for a reason. I always had a feeling the spot missing in her cape was this spot as well. This also again confirms the LP area. I guess I just don’t think that spot missing is nothing.
These are just some of my random thoughts.. want more of my craziness you can find me at the places below.
https://instagram.com/savral/
https://www.facebook.com/Savral
https://twitter.com/savral
https://www.flickr.com/photos/savral
My personal website
http://sonofstallis.com/
You can tell me what you think. I might be crazy, but I will continue looking for this thing until either I find it or someone else does.
Edit : Removed some of the pictures and just left the links intact. Lot of my pictures come up way too big. Sorry about that.

MrSeabass

It’s buried in Pere Marquette Park. End of discussion.

Would you care to elaborate some? Thoughts? Reasoning? How it fits with the verse?

Unknown

Unknown:
What’s your current thinking on this bridge and these lines Savral?

Unknown

Unknown:
Starting from under each of these bridges, where exactly does 100 paces southeast get you?

erexere

Savral, the Wells Fargo connection is certainly dismissible. I’m uncertain if the idea has any utility yet. Thats really the trick AFAIC. There are several reasons I’ve become interested in the idea.
1. The first line may contain a double meaning. A synonym for the word “stories” is “accounts”. A bank is something which has accounts or also found along a river, suggested by lines about a culvert and bridge. Wells Fargo is a bank.
2. Wells street could implicate a deeper connection for some specific reason. I liked the HG Wells idea because it drew from a populqr literary reference and might laterally compare dwarves to Morlocks, both associated with hidden tunnels. Milwauk-KEY and Mor-LOCK seems momentarily interesting, but the utility of the Time Machine isnt apparent to me. I’ve tried to see the juggling of balls as a metaphor for jumping around from point to point on a map. Hidden tunnels and portals might be a thematic design characteristic to the puzzle.
3. “At a distance”, being repeated in two lines may lend special significance to a connection like “Prospect” as a street name connection or “Go far” as a “Fargo” connection.
4. Wells Fargo was also known for over land transportation of letters and parcels and might be in part the inspiration for the line preceeding the wonderstone’s hearth.
The process of making these associations may only go as deep as 1. Consider the name Wells, 2. Consider a bank named Wells Fargo, 3. Consider going far from some point of origin. When we consider the Cleveland or Chicago puzzles, its already a given that some visual elements are over a mile or two distance away, i.e. Terminal Tower/Historic Water Tower. Its probably a good argument that the casque in Milwaukee is also to be found at least 2 or even 3 miles away from the City Hall building.

I didn’t even address your questions WhiteRabbit and Erexre, my apologies.
Since these two are tied together let me answer them as one. To be totally honest, I never understood why Preiss would have us go up the stairs just to walk a bit and then go back down to the street we were originally at. I by no means disregarded them, and in fact did the paces from them. What makes this even more convoluted is what a pace is. Some people believe it’s one step to the next, while others believe it’s your first foot reaches the second spot and then it begins again. At 100 paces using the second definition, you are on the other side of LMD (Lincoln Memorial Drive) right before the beach. Using the first definition, you’re halfway between the underneath of the bridge and the first sidewalk on LMD.
Of course the next main obstacle is trying to locate any kind of birch tree. I have been to the historical society, library and all kinds of stuff to try to locate old photos from that whole area, but I have only seen a few with Birch trees that stick out like sore thumbs. As for the girlscouts markers.. did we get a definite find that those were there in 81? I have seen a few around but I know they have been pulled out of a lot of them.
Also nice find with the Fairy Tale. Glad you put it up. Don’t think it has anything to do with the secret, but I totally welcome some new stuff that might awaken a light bulb.
I mean.. you make a good argument and who am I to say you’re not correct, Heck, I still have a strong feeling the 3 stories of Mitchell is the domes and there is a lot of stairs that go down to another street below to the west, but the amount of vagabonds under the bridge and what not make it somewhat unsafe to just go alone. Shame the winter is coming and this will soon have to wait another year.

Last thing.. I decided to draw it out last night because I had some extra time. A little rough, but bear with me. Little sleep but this has always looked pretty close to me. I’m a bit tired and I’m throwing yet another idea out there, but hey.. we are all trying to figure something out.

It’s now been years since I first posted this pic comparing the shoulder and neck area to a map visual. At first it was arbritrary, since I had no understanding of how a person could get from point A (Mitchell Hall/Wisconsin Club/City Hall, take your pick) to point B (Kosciuszko Park along Lincon Ave.) It’s more concievable to me now when I take an actual compass and walk it across a map in a direction that is consistent with using the value 200 as a direction in degrees. It’s hard to accept, as it doesn’t compare to the “simplicity” of methods used in Chicago and Cleveland. Oh well…maybe it’s just meant to be a representation of German engineering…
Anyway, I still like this pic, I haven’t rotated it in the image, since it looks easy enouth to pick out how the curved line of the park path fits if you rotate 180 degrees, similarly to how the Centaur’s tail was rotated to fit the curved road around the Gardens in Cleveland image,

Are there any constellations that we could attribute to a woman playing a harp?

Also here is an interesting article on City Hall. Apparently there is a spiral staircase that leads you up to the bell tower and observation deck.
http://onmilwaukee.com/buzz/articles/ci … ?viewall=1
and here is the bell at the top and some interesting photo’s shot from up there.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/wrokic/4881694661/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/wrokic/48 … otostream/
This would be the view east…prominent in the view would have been the fountain at Cathedral Sq. Park where the stage is setup, and St. John’s cathedral. I don’t know if this means anything or how many steps are in that spiral staircase to the bell tower, but I just wanted to post what I find.

Frisco,
If you look closely at a clear image of the tree trunks, you can see that the center trunk
is not really curved over like a pipe, but has a separate rounded top edge.
AP

Unknown

Unknown:
The verse kinda gives you a path from that place to the nearby objects referenced earlier, but taking it as a literal interpretation, a person would meander quite a bit.

And despite this, you favor this solution over one where a literal interpretation of the Verse gives you a direct and logical route from Point A to Point T? With confirming evidence at almost every decision point along the way? I’m sorry, but I’ll take that over ‘kinda” if you don’t mind. Besides, your premise that the presence of City Hall in the Image is indicative of a starting point for walking is flawed, if not demonstrably false, as we have seen time and time again.
In Chicago, the treasure was found almost a mile and a half from the Water Tower, another Iconic Building that as it turns out, has almost nothing to do with the treasure site. And by the time you get to the first clue in the associated Verse, you have already walked over a mile, with nothing to confirm that you are on the right path. The Cleveland Image has the unmistakable silhouette of the Terminal Tower, and yet we know for a fact that the treasure was found almost 4 miles away (as the crow flies), again with nothing in the Verse to get you from one to the other. And in Roanoke, the starting point called out in the Verse is almost 16 miles from the presumptive treasure ground, which for any but the hardiest of souls, we can agree is too far to walk. And so on throughout the puzzle as a whole. In short, to assume that the Iconic Building (whether called out in the Image or Verse) is in any way proximate to the Treasure Ground is to ignore a significant amount of evidence that would indicate that the opposite may in fact be the case.

Still looks like a candy cane to me, AP. :p

Glossiphoniidae

…
From woman, with harpsichord (Where you see the Grand Olde Lady Building with a harp)
I’ll let you take it from there.

I cannot understand how a clue about an antique piano has anything to do with lyre-shaped lamps or an upright stringed instrument without a keyboard. I’ve quit following every theory with any mention of harps.
I do think that the comma must be important to the clue. We might not be looking for a woman AT a harpsichord, but perhaps we branch from a location tied to that woman and then procede by using a harpsichord clue in some way.

The voice of logic …
So good to hear from you, Catherwood

Savral and Lady Poverty, welcome. Savral, I don’t follow your process at all, at least not to the point where I share any excitement for digging yet. I’m not saying you’re crazy either. I’m glad you’re getting down to business tho and looking at the big picture as things wouldve existed back in 1980.
So, those three trees in a row, are they consistent with the description of arriving at the first and passing three more on the west side? What is your proud tall fifth?
How do you think about the woman with harpsichord?

I am working with some city park officials to get this done the legal way so no worries. I appreciate the heads up on the fine for digging. I was not trying to bug JPP but maybe just urge him to put whatever he has in a lock box or basically something that could be found when he eventually passes away. Maybe he will, maybe he wont. With that being said, let me put up a few things and kinda put you where my head was at for this other spot. I love the Lake Park idea but I moved my attention to Pere Marquette park which is where I saw a few things.
While the Lake Park birch trees appear to be gone or cut down, Pere Marquette has 3 right in a row.
Also the Harp Lamp (which after digging into further, Milwaukee is the ONLY place that has these)
While this might be a stretch, the Milwaukee County Historical Society railings that are very visible from outside look very close to the collar image.
Lastly, and this is where I am looking at it different… The Letter of the World. The Journal sentinel company is across the street from the park. A major newspaper .. letter to the world. Furthermore, the outside which is still original has the color of Wonderstone.
There is one other thing in this park that really strikes my eye, but until I can get the proper approval, I am going to hold off on it. Call me crazy, but I am trying to look at this from a different angle. Basically, the picture and verses (a part of them at least) is just to identify the city. I think the main thing in all the pictures is obviously the clue to where it’s buried somewhere within the picture. In this instance it’s the cap which I think we can all agree on is the main clue to when you find the spot.
Like I said earlier… I could be way off. A lot of good people put in a lot of time. I 100% respect and appreciate all their work they did. With that being said, I am here in Milwaukee and have a general interest in finding this. I am not a fan of how much government interferes with everything, but I understand the necessity in it. However after being told if I ever did find anything it wouldn’t matter because “It’s on city property so anything found on it belongs to the city.” is bullshit to me. I guess I honestly fear that many attempts and good searches and hard work will be put into figuring all of these out, just to be stonewalled by some asshole behind a desk. I know they dont want digging all over and it could be dangerous, but with diggers hotline, the internet, and a few quick looks at the area.. I feel it should be approved or not approved pretty quickly.
One last thing before I shut up here. When BP buried these… did he get approval? Did he have to pull permits? Run this past anyone to make sure he wasn’t fined or hit any kind of line? I’m guessing not, which is why the spirit of the game is being trashed in my opinion over time.
Anyways.. would love to hear what you guys think.
Edit : looks like for whatever reason the first picture of the birch trees was cut off. I have the full picture if someone is interested in looking at it or just go directly to the link off my website.

Yeah, I’m unable to see all the birches. I started a public Facebook page titled MKE Hunt. I have a picture of the birches there since I seem to be inept at posting them here.
Here is the link/ hope it works.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid … =1&theater
Edited to add:
I also went ahead and posted all the photos I referenced in my earlier posts. Feel free to join the group if you’d like. Or not if you prefer to remain anonymous.

Hi Everyone,
Sorry for the whiny tone at the close of my last post. I’d submitted a few comments on the threads and none were being approved. For whatever reason I thought perhaps the community wasn’t keen on newcomers. After pestering another user and finally tracking down a mod via 12 here I am. I’d also like to say that I hear you guys about the importance of getting the correct permissions regarding a dig. I’d never just go around all willy nilly with a shovel. Not that I’m close to a solve anyways….
With that said, I live in Milwaukee. In the past I’d heard about The Secret but my interest was piqued when I saw/ heard at how close to a solution you all are and it all seems far less hopeless with the magic of the interwebs. I’ve read the majority of the Image 10/ Verse 8 posts. So much amazing work and information here. Just amazing guys.
I have free time on my hands these days and took a walk around Lake Park and Pere Marquette. Knowing the focus is on Lake Park I did snap some photos while I was there. I am sure a lot of this is old news but I figured that it can’t hurt and sometimes it takes fresh eyes… maybe someone’ll have an A-ha moment.
I also went to the Milwaukee Public Library and found a few things. I am pretty sure that Decibel also mentioned checking out the humanities room but I am not sure what he found, I may have missed his/her post. Found some old images of Lake Park. Their logs, as far as dates are concerned, are categorized as pre and post 1960. There were only three images from post 1960 and they did not have more specific dates than that. I took pictures of all of them (I don’t think I was supposed to but I also wasn’t told not to). I will try attaching all of these however this commenting system is antiquated to me and I don’t know how to code so all images will likely end up in a pile at the bottom ( AT THE FOOT OF THE CULVERT GUYS).
Regarding the Pre 1960 shots, I found some of the ravine but they were likely from the early 1900’s in the form of the old school postcards. I also spotted a few birches.
I was able to find a little booklet put together by Friends of Lake Park on trees of Lake Park. It isn’t very long but it does map out the park and identifies a few “champion” trees. Maybe this has all been seen already so I apologize if this comment is a bit of an echo chamber of previous posts. I thought it was an interesting find. It has an index with illustrations of the described trees. I was able to actually borrow this book because it was a part of the lending library. Everything else was in the reference rooms and not able to be checked out.
It is saying the board attachment quota has been reached…. wth?
I also found a cool city issued architectural plan for the riverwalk from 1980. It has what existed in 1980, three proposed plans and the final, blueprints if you will, of what is there now. Again, I get that everyone is fond of Lake Park but I know the laureate is across from Pere Marquette and I feel it is worth looking into further. Maybe something was there before the construction that we can link from this book. This was found in the reference room so I don’t have it on me but did snap a pic of the cover and can go back. I did not have the time to go through it beyond a quick skim. If I can figure out how to post pics here I will post everything.
I was thinking of going to Lake Park and making a video so that everyone can see the ravines/trees/ bridges up close. Perhaps this has been done already as well. Let me know if anyone would be interested in such a thing.
Glad to be here.
LP

Savral,
Good find on the pattern! I was just there on Monday looking around. What I noticed was the trees that line the sidewalk with the copper? or iron? grates over them. Cast in copper/ step on nature. Also, there is a sign in that park that I have a photo of with the date 1892 on it and my mind wandered to the 92 steps line. Although there are no steps as in stairs and then I thought maybe steps was meant as in strides but it does say ascend. hmmmm. Then I started thinking about the compass etc and got a bit discouraged. Although i did not look at the sides of the buildings closely either. I agree that a lot of the verse could just be to place one in Mke and the visual clues are for finding the treasure perhaps. I saw those birches too… all lined up perfectly. I wandered into the historical society for a bit too, they have lots of records of parks but I had already been downtown for hours at that point so i didn’t look into it further.

Hey Lady Poverty, welcome.
I tried to edit my original post but for some reason I can’t find a way to do it. Here are the pictures again but this time resized.
To answer your question Erexere. I believe the Harp reference is for Milwaukee’s unique Harp Lamps. Here is some links to explain it.
http://www.retrocom.com/retromilw/harp.htm
http://landmarkhunter.com/197946-harp-luminai341e/

I think somewhere buried in these threads there was reference made to the harp lights. I noticed them in Lake Park too. They have Gs on the bottom of them too (in lake park but not Pere). I have a close up that I’ll post to the Facebook I made. Mke Hunt.

Savral

I tried to edit my original post but for some reason I can’t find a way to do it. Here are the pictures again but this time resized.
https://savral.files.wordpress.com/2015 … _80941.jpg
https://savral.files.wordpress.com/2015 … _80951.jpg
https://savral.files.wordpress.com/2015 … _80971.jpg
https://savral.files.wordpress.com/2015 … _80991.jpg

Friendly advice: Just give the LINKS to your images. Do not embed them here. Whatever the size, it takes time to load from an external website (and might exceed someone’s bandwidth limits, especially when viewed on a MOBILE device). These lock up my computer, and I hit the STOP button to just read the text. (I can click on a link for myself when I want to view any images.)

Savral, again, great job on spotting the pattern! I was hanging out for like 45 minutes and didn’t catch it. I am never sure what is new around here because so many of the links are broken from years ago.

Here is an image of a smaller bell I saw during my little tour. This made me think of the small bell shape in mystery lady’s right hand. Much smaller than the huge bell that sits in City Hall. This is on Kilbourn just as you go over the bridge heading west before you arrive at Pere Marquette on your right.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0418217 … 312!8i6656
I just found this looking around on Google Earth. Check out the pattern of the rails on the bridge. This is along State St looking South? on the East bank of the Riverwalk… the laureate is just behind it.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0430677 … 312!8i6656
Edited to add:
Another small bell
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0429369 … 312!8i6656

Unknown

Unknown:
In 1891 three Milwaukee businessmen, General F. C. Winkler, George Koeppen and Henry Gugler, held several meetings with sixty other men at the old Plankinton House Hotel to organize the founding of a new social club. The purpose of the club was to promote and provide a venue for German-American understanding and fellowship, a reflection of the large German immigration to Milwaukee at the end of the nineteenth century.
The first home of the new club, called the ‘Deutscher’ or ‘German’ Club, was in the Old Opera House near the site of the present Pabst Theatre. In early 1894 a fire broke out and severely damaged the clubrooms. A new home had to be found.
Several alternatives were considered including disbanding the club which was in a poor financial state. When the vacant Mitchell Mansion on Grand Avenue (now Wisconsin Avenue) was brought to the attention of club members, shortly after the death of Alexander Mitchell, all thoughts of dissolution vanished. An offer of over $100,000 was made and accepted. The Deutscher Club moved into its new quarters in early 1895 and began to settle in for a long stay.
On May 1, 1895 the Club held their opening night party in the Mitchell home with over 450 attendees; this without any of the new rooms which were eventually added by the Club.

Das Boot Theory
continued 2/2
Verse line 1, I prefer the Mitchell connection of the Alexander Mitchell House (Wisconsin Club) at 900 Grand Ave. (now W. Wisconsin Ave). From this I presume we’re either on a path fixed to one of four streets: 9th or 10th street, Wisconsin Ave. or W. Wells St. assuming you’re viewing it’s 3 stories from any one of the bordering streets.
Verse line 2, if my WWII theory is correct, confirms that we’re on W. Wells. as we view it. This doesn’t yet give us any specific direction to walk, and so we might asume having walked all around the Mitchell House before connecting to our next clue.
Verse line 3 and 5 stress the importance of some measure of distance dealing with the unit of time and space. I’ve jumped to the idea of using the Imperial Units Standards based on the word ‘Imperial’ being used in the reference to Germany in the Litany of the Jewels. Since we see the word ‘three’ being used three times in the verse, I’ve considered these lines about time and space have to do with the 3 miles walked in 1 hour unit of distance known as an Imperial League. This suggests to me that point of interest A and point of interest B might be one league apart or having to do with a “league” in another sense, like a team sport. One way to examine this might be to take a draft compass, set the center to the Mitchell House and draw a 3 mile radius arc on the city map and then see what might be interesting. 3 miles exactly south from the Wells St. side of the Mitchell House takes us to Modrzejewski Park. 3 miles northeast takes you to a spot in Lake Park just off of E. Belleview Place or about 1000 feet southwest of North Point Lighthouse.
Verse line 4 may be a good reference to the founders of the “Deutscher” German Club that took up residence in the vacated Mitchell House,
The pattern on the woman’s collar in the image matches the doors to the Pabst Theater very well. This may be considered a strong connection to the Deutscher Club.
Verse line 6 is simply phenomenal. I’m currently holding onto the wild idea that it has to do with chambermaids.
Verse line 7 in connection with a chambermaid has me thinking of the vacuum cleaner. This is such a fresh thought, that its probably wrong, but for the moment I like the previous use of the word ‘space’, combined with ‘silently’ makes me think of the “sound doesn’t travel in a vacuum” idea. Jumping to the different sense of the word and a maid servant really appeals to me.

Unknown

Unknown:
Here is something i haven’t liked about the grand staircase: It’s very obvious, and theoretically allows anyone to pick up the hunt in the middle, or shoot, toward the end.

True, but only to a point. It’s not enough to find the 92 steps, although that’s a great start. Before one can be fully convinced that these are the correct steps, (s)he needs to be convinced that the 9 lines that precede “ascend the 92 steps” lead clearly and unambiguously to the bottom of that staircase. Since I absolutely believe this to be the case (with only minor hiccups that I am willing to discount to “poetic license on Preiss’ part), I’m willing to continue my search from this point with confidence. Of course, I am assuming a clear, linear path, but in the case of Verse 8, I think that is what we are dealing with.
For the record, I don’t think for one minute that Preiss walked this exact route with a shovel and a backpack, looking for a place to dig a hole. He probably scouted the location and the surrounding area first, then later drove and parked on LMD. Walking the park a second time, he took pictures and notes, and finding himself back on LMD (but from a different direction), decided he had too much invested in the area to not bury the casque there. Near the soccer field was just the most convenient place (although as we are finding out, a killer in terms of long term viability of some of the clues). Pure speculation on my part, but consistent with me trying to put myself in his boots in an effort to understand the methodology a little bit more.

Here is why I don’t think it is in the woods…or in an area behind the woodline. This could be totally wrong, but I am just using common sense. BP had a shovel and a box to bury (as far as we know). If you’ve done any digging or landscaping, you know that any wooded area is bound to have large root systems all over the place. BP didn’t fly around with an axe and I doubt he bought one in every city and left it… To get in and out, and have dug a 3′ hole, buried something and covered it back up…he wouldn’t want to mess around with roots or anything that would cause a delay in getting it done. Not to say he didn’t clear the burial sites ahead of time…maybe testing the locations to see if they were good for someone to dig a hole in without too much notice, I’m not ruling it out…but I don’t think he did.
Chicago was not in the woods, trees were planted after he was there and we were told the 10 by 13 was a foot measurement.
Cleveland wasn’t in the woods, although it was in a planter box in an area near woods.
If the Houston and St. Augustine theories are correct they wouldn’t be in a woods either.
The reverse of this is that Milwaukee is one of the few images that has any kind of architectural representation in it…no stone pillars, buildings (city hall is just a city indicator,) hardly any designs that can clearly be matched to anything in architecture like the fence post in Chi or Siskel and Eg’s wall. It has visual clues starring you right in the face…but the image on the cape…what many consider 1 of the 2 big indicators….not a wall, or fence, or anything apparently man made…no…a tree of some sort. It’s been discussed that the bumps on the trees could represent the 4 tree’s you need to find the “proud tall 5th.” The straight one in the center has 1 small bump, the one to the left of center 2 bumps, right of center 3 bumps, and the 4th one seems to have many bumps at least 4. Are these the pass 3…ridiculous!
I don’t want this to be buried in the forest or near the woodline, but based on the picture, all the visuals I have come across, and the lack of any kind of visual indicator for something other than trees…I feel this one may be real close to a wood line or near a tree. I have to accept there is a more than fair chance that it could be near a tree…unfortunately. If there were any more obvious indications of visual clues other than trees I would be skeptical, but with as much tree stuff as I see in the image…SIGH…it could be near a tree.

Montreal’s verse specifically calls out the forest, it’s likely buried in a more wooded area. Though it also gives you a direct landmark to look for (stone closet). It also uses paces as a count off, which I just don’t like at all. Not that I disagree with “paces” being literal paces taken by an adult human, but just because as was shown in CLE you can be so close and still completely miss the casque. Paces seems really arbitrary when a foot in either direction matters a ton.

To the doubters (photos courtesy stercox), once again, from the top:
Bonus:

Unknown

Unknown:
Here is something i haven’t liked about the grand staircase: It’s very obvious, and theoretically allows anyone to pick up the hunt in the middle, or shoot, toward the end.

Well, thanks Forest, that seems pretty conclusive…though I doubt Erexere will have any of it…
I wouldn’t get too hung up on the idea of the Grand Staircase being too obvious and in the middle. There need to be
some
intelligible clues FFS, and burying them under more obscure references seems as good a way of sowing confusion as any.

Thanks. Now I see how you have tailored the count to exclude those 3 steps that aren’t used to climb to the top, and dismiss the 4 steps on the approach to the first landing.
Its a great candidate, but WRabbit is right, Im not convinced.
The Plankington Arcade is all together 92 steps, no more, no less, so its also a candidate. Something more that I’m examining is the possibility of using the last entry in the Abroad in America book to justify Byrons fascination with H.G. Wells. Remember the cool rotating disk on the back of the Time Machine in the film? Take a moment and look at the Plankington Arcade Wishing Well center and statue surrounded by circle of stairs. It looks quite similar to me. It is something you “cast in copper” pennies into for making a wish.
My point is start at W W_ll_(900 W.Wells) and walk south 1 block to 900 Grand Ave. (Deutscher Club/Mitchell House), walk 7 blocks (seven juggled objects?) east to 200 Grand Grand Ave., toss a penny, make a wish and be transported through time and space to the casque’s location. Watch out for Morlocks…

Here’s the thing with the “7 juggled objects” thing – we have no way of ever knowing if that’s right. So far we have 2 puzzles solved with more or less straightforward clues. There are directions and Polaroids snapped along the way to confirm that you’re following the correct path.
SO FAR there isn’t an instance of having to use the image to interpret a clue, they just confirm you’re on the right path, or offer their own clues (map of OH for example). How would one know to do that, and how could one
ever
know that they’re right? I think that every step you take can be confirmed visually in the image, and as such I think taking 7 anything because their are 7 objects is folly.

Agreed. Folly. We are dealing with the Dwarven puzzle…depths unknown.

Xieish

Here’s the thing with the “7 juggled objects” thing – we have no way of ever knowing if that’s right. So far we have 2 puzzles solved with more or less straightforward clues. There are directions and Polaroids snapped along the way to confirm that you’re following the correct path.
SO FAR there isn’t an instance of having to use the image to interpret a clue, they just confirm you’re on the right path, or offer their own clues (map of OH for example). How would one know to do that, and how could one
ever
know that they’re right? I think that every step you take can be confirmed visually in the image, and as such I think taking 7 anything because their are 7 objects is folly.

Let me understand….you are saying that every line of the verse should have an image confirmation or???

Unknown

Unknown:
To the doubters (photos courtesy stercox), once again, from the top:

Not me. Of all the slam dunks in this puzzle, and there aren’t that many, this is one of the slam dunkiest. Ironically, it is immediately followed by the most obscure (at least to me) clue.

Kozy park is not the greatest neighborhood. If I happen to be travelling by there I will get some shots for you, but I just feel that it’s the wrong location for so many reasons that if I am going to work on this, I’d rather spend the time in a location that fits all the clues in the verse.
Erexere, not to discourage you, cause it looks like you’re having a lot of fun and coming up with interesting parallels…but even I have a hard time following some of your streams of consciousness. I don’t think Milwaukee is any different than Cleveland or Chicago…the verse should take you right to the treasure grounds without having to use too much creative license. If there was a clear case for Kozy Park, I’d be with you 100%…there is just too much lacking for that location, and everything is represented in Lake Park…very hard to throw a location that has everything to make the verse work right in it. Just because there was 1 dig at a suspected area that came up blank, doesn’t mean that the treasure isn’t there. TenByThirteen said they dug like 6 or 7 holes before finding the Chicago casque. Even after BP confirmed they were in the right spot, they dug 3 holes and found nothing. Then he sent them a photo of the burial spot, and they dug, and were about to give up and Rob or someone threw the shovel in disgust and when they did some dirt fell off a side wall in the hole exposing the casque.
Maybe the first dig was in the wrong area, but why rule out a place that seems to fit everything in the verse better than any other place in the city does.
Like I said, I sometimes go through that area…if it’s daylight out, I will get you pictures next time I do.

Thanks!
I completely understand.

decibalnyc

TenByThirteen said they dug like 6 or 7 holes before finding the Chicago casque. Even after BP confirmed they were in the right spot, they dug 3 holes and found nothing.

Well, exactly. And in the Cleveland hunt they started at the wrong end of the flower bed and dug for five hours before they ended up in the right place. But BP and JJP obviously didn’t mean for you to bring a bulldozer and start tearing up these public parks. They wanted you to use a different and very precise system to find the spot for digging.
The visual references and the clues in the text will get you to the right general area, but once you’re there you’ll still need to do the geometry. (Or bring a backhoe.)

Unknown

Unknown:
The visual references and the clues in the text will get you to the right general area, but once you’re there you’ll still need to do the geometry

I’m not sure I agree with this. In Cleveland, the verse told them exactly where to dig, based on the placement of certain stones in the wall. The problem was that “right to left” should have been “left to right”. The geometry is nice, but they had everything they needed to dig up the casque without it. And in the case of Chicago, if the geometry was so important to the final dig location, don’t you think Priess would have told them that they were on the right track, but missing something that would confirm the precise spot, instead of just sending them the picture? Especially given his reticence with the good people here for the same type of help when time and renovation had significantly altered the visual clues, and his help would have been truly appreciated? And in Milwaukee, the verse is clear: dig at the southern foot of a tall tree with a letter on it. But the tree is gone, and with it, the precise location of the casque, geometry notwithstanding.
The geometry is nice, and in some form that I am still noodling with, points to something that you should be able to see clearly when standing on the treasure ground, or would have seen in 1982. But I don’t think that it points the precise location of the casque.

When Erexere said Milwaukee was a special case, that’s defiantly correct. It has very little in the way of obvious clues. At least in Chicago and Cleveland, the clues are distinct…the wall, the fence post, the fountain, the bowman, all we have is a mish mash of dark trees, dark outlines, and the objects in the rebus code. The pattern from the Pabst Theater, that’s difficult, it’s only on 1 place on 1 outside door, so if you’ve never been in there you wouldn’t recognize it. Even City Hall is all dark and blurred out. The dark images all over the cape and gown…I mean c’mon…is it a horse hoof, is it a tree, is it a topo map…it’s insane, is it a bell, a shoreline, a road…is that the lighthouse between the 4 trunk tree, is it a lamp, is it a tree….
Out of all the images I have found that this one makes my brain hurt the most.

Euhirudinea

I’m not sure I agree with this. In Cleveland, the verse told them exactly where to dig, based on the placement of certain stones in the wall. The problem was that “right to left” should have been “left to right”.

Can you see the contradiction in what you just wrote? You’re saying that the verse gives the exact location and the only problem is that the verse is wrong. That’s a problem all right.
I salute Egbert for his persistence, but I don’t think many of us could get away with digging for five hours or over that broad an area in the other casque locations. BP needed a precise way of pinpointing the exact spot so searchers would dig only a single hole. He gave his readers multiple pathways to get to the general area, but then he used a set of geometry problems to put people in the exact spot.
Did you look at that line I posted in the thread for Image 4? It doesn’t just go to the general area. It doesn’t just go close. It goes over the
exact spot
. (A line from the hand through the jewel, by the way, goes wide by about 15 feet.) Of course, a straight line contains an infinite number of points. One needs an intersecting line to define a single point. Hmm….
How goes the Milwaukee search, by the way?

Oregonian

I salute Egbert for his persistence, but I don’t think many of us could get away with digging for five hours or over that broad an area in the other casque locations.
How goes the Milwaukee search, by the way?

Forest, Pine, and several others dug for 5+ hours around the base of a tree in Milwaukee in 2006 uncovering a yard and a half of dirt.
The Milwaukee search is good, have a few new locations, a mock up of the casque and box on the way, and all of next week to work…steady as she goes.

Unknown

Unknown:
Can you see the contradiction in what you just wrote? You’re saying that the verse gives the exact location and the only problem is that the verse is wrong. That’s a problem all right.

But the verse does gives us an exact location to dig:
In a rectangular plot
Beneath the tenth stone
From right to left
Beneath the ninth row from the top
Of the wall including small bricks
Our line experiment suggests one as well. Problem is, they are on opposite sides of the planter. There are only four possibilities that reconcile both conditions:
1) The verse has a directional error in it. Change “right to left” to “left to right” and we are good to go. Everything fits together nicely.
2) The interpretation of the verse is wrong. Egbert was there, so perhaps he is the best person to ask if this was a possibility. But as written, it only works if you are counting stones as you face away from the wall. Kinda hard to do.
3) The interpretation of the line experiment is wrong. It suggests the planter, but it is not meant to suggest the exact spot in the planter.
4) The casque was buried on the left side, but shifted to the right side over the 20 years that it was in the ground, either naturally or during a remodel.
Since I’m not sold on the idea of the geometry leading to an exact dig spot, I’m leaning toward the first explanation as being the most likely. But I’m willing to be convinced if you can show how it works for Chicago and Milwaukee. I just can’t see how those images allow the same level of precision that you are touting in Cleveland.

To clarify, I don’t see any evidence that this “divider” or compass method is used in any other puzzle. I think its unique to Milwaukee for its focus on the dwarf themed jewel as something of a stereotypical view that the dwarfs are known for their masonry and engineering. I wonder if that’s how Gygax portrayed them in late 79 or 80.
This is why I think its really important to find a good reference match of city hall to position. Its exactly how someone would go about tailoring such a method to plot a course as the crow flies.
I have one request for anyone local to Milwaukee: please take a photo of the west side boot of the Kosciouszko monument. Lets compare the wrinkles above its ankle to the shape depicted in the cloak that is thought to be a multi-trunked tree.

Let’s talk about the hints from the Japanese translation for a minute. The “clue” regarding:
As you walk the beating of the world
seems to be explained that beating is similar to a drum, look in the dictionary and find a name near the word drum. (paraphrasing here)
Could this line be pointing us to two things? Downer would be an interesting take on the beating, Beat down or depressing. Is it possibly used to locate us at Kenwood and Downer, setting the direction from Mitchell Hall to Lake Park?

gManTexas

Let’s talk about the hints from the Japanese translation for a minute. The “clue” regarding:
As you walk the beating of the world
seems to be explained that beating is similar to a drum, look in the dictionary and find a name near the word drum. (paraphrasing here)
Could this line be pointing us to two things? Downer would be an interesting take on the beating, Beat down or depressing. Is it possibly used to locate us at Kenwood and Downer, setting the direction from Mitchell Hall to Lake Park?

Well, starting here, AP found something that she thinks reinforces the Kenwood theory, especially because of the ‘drum’ hint:
http://quest4treasure.co.uk/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=7258&start=315#p145517
(Kenwood Dennard…..prodigy drummer….also see subsequent posts from AP in the thread.)

Mister EZ

Well, starting here, AP found something that she thinks reinforces the Kenwood theory, especially because of the ‘drum’ hint:
http://quest4treasure.co.uk/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=7258&start=315#p145517
(Kenwood Dennard…..prodigy drummer….also see subsequent posts from AP in the thread.)

I saw that. Not a strong connection IMHO.

I agree.
About as strong as Kenwood Stereos, Kenwood Electric Mixers or Kenwood Drum Tables…which, still leads to the Grand Staircase (from the North), the same place that the podcast’s solution leads (from the South).

I think the 200 degrees is just a coincidence – just like the 130 degrees over Lincoln’s shoulder in Chicago was a coincidence (10 x 13). The wording of the verse “after climbing the grand 200” doesn’t quite jibe with 200 degrees after ascending the 92 steps.
As for the fact that you don’t see the lighthouse/compass from the top of the steps, I do not think you are necessarily supposed to see it. My guess is that BP described the lighthouse by calling it a compass (the Northpoint lighthouse), and that you are supposed to figure out that you must go past it by traveling south/southwest from the top of the stairs, even though you cannot see it. These clues are supposed to be somewhat difficult, so he wants you to at least look around and figure out that you must go in that direction in order to “pass” it. If he describes everything you can see as you walk the trail, it would be too easy.

a valiant effort but there is a glaring error that throws you way off…

anus905

a valiant effort but there is a glaring error that throws you way off…

It’s weird how anyone other than four21thrasher thinks they can get away with supremely weak trolling. It’s just weird to make the effort to put into writing an opinion which holds zero substance.
When you say there is a glaring error, you seem to have no understanding that this is a puzzle for which no solution manual presently exists. The only thing that is glaring is your ignorance. You, like anyyone else, is entitled to an opinion, but a basic principle or practice of intelligence would include some shred of comprehension or basis for what detail or supporting fact gives life to your opinion. Heck, nobody has any idea what you’re referring to in most cases.
The recent discussion here has included ideas about the meaning of wonderstone’s hearth. It’s fair to look at what kind of stone typically gets used in a fireplace. Makes sense. Whether that’s right or not for the purpose of this puzzle has yet to be determined. My opinion, alternatively, is that the puzzle has singled out a particularly interesting stone object, representing a particular country, and it’s something which conveys the spirit of warmth, welcome, leadership, or support. I could see this being an inscription on a memorial.

that clue is easy. the sad part is im not the only one to have solved it………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….

forest_blight

It’s official – On Monday May 8, stercox, myself, and our respective treasure-hunting buddies will be digging in Lake Park in Milwaukee.

I think that’s a great day to dig!
Saturday, May 8, 2004 — Siskel and I dug up the Cleveland casque.

And its the Monday following the Kentucky Derby.

Well, I had to postpone my trip which looks like it worked out for the best.  Good luck you guys, I think it’s fitting that it turned into a group effort.  Don’t forget the great Milwaukee earthquake of 1990 moved around a lot of earth and may have broken up the casque.
(For me, the entire month is April Fool’s Day.)

erexere

The ornament hanging from the tree certainly resembles the basic structure for a Fort, which has been discussed, so I have to wonder what BP’s motives were when he put this together.

more importantly it is the exact shape of fort Sumter, in the charleston bay…

OMG, omg, omg…there’s so much going on in this thread it makes my head spin.
I just discovered this thread.  I’m having difficulty finding my way around because of the different notions about which verse pairs with which image.
If I cross post to both the threads for which I think an image and verse match, then I suppose it’s in the right place.
One of my omg’s was after going through about a hundred posts and seeing pics of folks with their tarps out and digging, man, people have been through a lot around here.
Anyways, this is verse 8 discussion and I am unclear on whether you’re pairing it with Image 10, 1, or 2.
Here’s why I think it is 2:  The Mitchell (verse) connection to Africanology (image), the wonderstone/hearth (verse) connection to a moth’s wing spots and attraction to a flame (image ..see moth winged lady).  A line may be drawn through these two points that points to Lake Park.

erexere — this just can’t be right. There is a map of Charleston on the mask’s forehead. That’s pretty definitive, even if it weren’t for the latitude / longitude.

I’m only three threads deep on this site.
Where’s the map to charleston thread?

found it, it’s all the Image 2 discussion, and yes, you’re right, it is a map of charleston and so I’m befuddled.  I thought the map portions looked passable for Africa/Madigascar…
At this point, since I’m having a number of difficulties grasping the depth here.  I certainly want to contribute, so it might be that my offerings go against what is widely accepted.  It’s a toughy.  If it helps for me to nod my head in agreement from time to time, I’ll do that too.  I really do like the Charleston possibilities.  The ornament hanging from the tree certainly resembles the basic structure for a Fort, which has been discussed, so I have to wonder what BP’s motives were when he put this together.  It’s difficult enough finding a needle in a haystack, but to put elements in that are red herrings would just be evil.
Please don’t hesitate to keep me informed of the consensus, it would help greatly.

erexere,
I’m sure it would help if you look over the Secret Wiki listed here:
http://thesecret.pbworks.com/w/page/22148559/FrontPage
Since the hunt started in 1982, there has been a lot of information gathered.
Not all of the combinations in the Wiki are correct or verified, but it helps
to get a feel for the hunt.  Maybe you could focus on the
one closest to you first…so you don’t get overwhelmed right away.
(That is so easy to do…
)
This is actually the online forum supporting the book
The Secret
.
There are so many online copies of the Images, and listings of the Verses,
that the book is probably not essential any more.
By now you have found out that the treasures originally given for finding the casques
in The Secret, are no longer part of the hunt.  The hunt’s creator died in 2005.
But the casques have taken on more importance, since they are now all that is left.
That being said, the greed and secrecy which usually accompany any treasure hunt,
are missing from this one. There is mostly a lot of sharing and camaraderie here.
Again, welcome to the clan!
AP
P.S. I am near Milwaukee, and am quite sure that the Verse 8 is paired with Image 10

Thanks for the help.  I can describe “the wall” in great detail already…
I have seen only one comment that works to explain the three stripes, a photo by forestblight showing “red white and blue”, but the picture I’m studying shows the second strip is yellow.  Which is it, white or yellow?

I actually found this symbol yesterday in matching street names to symbols. I was trying to get to Mason Street downtown and there is a Masonic temple by Cathedral Square.

At a distance in time
https://youtu.be/Wp20Sc8qPeo

Unknown

Unknown:
As you walk the beating of the world
At a distance in time
At a distance in space
Ascend the 92 steps
After climbing the grand 200
Pass the compass and reach
Walk 100 paces

I want to comment on these lines in the verse which bring attention to the words “walk”, “at a distance”, “ascend”, and “compass”. I think the justification for using these words might be to convey the use of tools on a map. Obviously the compass is such a tool, though it could be thought of in at least four different ways: a magnetic or directional compass, a divider tool having two “legs” used to measure a course plotting with precise distance measures on a map, a mark on the map itself usually a “compass” or “wind” rose, and the figurative use such as the “Northpoint” Lighthouse. Of these, my favorite is the divider. It is a tool which is physically moved (passed) over a map by “walking”. I’ve watched several instructional videos now and looked at written resources and every single time the word “walk” is used to instruct a person to move a compass or parallel ruler over a map. That brings me to the use of a parallel ruler. I realize that in the case of a ruler, in the sense of a leader of a country, such as a king, often utilizes the word “ascend”, basically meaning the top position where one ascends or climbs to that position by right or deposing their predecessor. “At a distance” are words which may be used to describe something extended, or protracted, a protractor being another map tool.
Another line comes to mind, “you’ll see a letter from the country,” may be that letter “G” for Germany that many people have conjectured, is it possibly the G that sits below a mason’s compass and above a square angle ruler?
Doesn’t the letter G in the Mason’s symbol stands for God, and not G-ermany? There is that open compound word “God’s country”, with the definition of a place beyond the frontier, away from civilization, which might be another justification to go a few miles distance from the inner city area of downtown MKE. There’s certainly an architectural element to the puzzle given the “three stories of Mitchell” and climbing of steps.
Anyway, I’m definitely feeling inclined to see that a compass and ruler are put to use on a map and I think the distance to be measured is approx 3 miles. I think the location of either City Hall or the Mitchell Building/Wisconsin Club is an anchoring point on a map.

Kalessin

the capital G in Germany. The masonic G that’s inside the compasses on the lampposts around the Grand Staircase.
No deep dive required.

I’d agree with this except nobody has proven the compass(G) plate covers were there in 82
I’ve heard actually the opposite, when researching them it turned out they were added later during a retrofit of the lamps and wiring.
I.e the masons sponsored the retrofit…
I would love it if it turned out they were there. but I dont think that is the case

Hm. Unfortunately, without photo confirmation of the plates in 1981, there’s no confirmation (and I thought someone had confirmed that they are there … hard to hold the entire body of knowledge, theory and wackyness found here in q4t and elsewhere on the internet).
But I’d still say that the “wonderstone” in the verse references “wonderstone” in The Tale Simply Told and the Litany of the Jewels.

Kalessin

Hm. Unfortunately, without photo confirmation of the plates in 1981, there’s no confirmation (and I thought someone had confirmed that they are there … hard to hold the entire body of knowledge, theory and wackyness found here in q4t and elsewhere on the internet).
But I’d still say that the “wonderstone” in the verse references “wonderstone” in The Tale Simply Told and the Litany of the Jewels.

never been one for thinking there were any clues in the rest of the book.
I think that BP as editor might have changed a word here and there. but I don’t think any of it is useful as clues.

Kalessin

Hm. Unfortunately, without photo confirmation of the plates in 1981, there’s no confirmation (and I thought someone had confirmed that they are there ..

hang on I will check.

(I don’t think I’ve seen this proposed meaning of these lines in this 160-page thread…)
“You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth”
In “The Secret” book, on page 7 (the page number is cut off in the “OCR” PDF version of the book, it’s the second page of “The Tale Simply Told”), and again on page 30, the fair folk’s treasures, the gemstones, are defined as “wonderstones”.
In The Litany of the Jewels, the wonderstone of Germany is amethyst. The jewel in Image 10, which is already very strongly associated with Verse 8, is amethyst.
Guessing that Byron Preiss used the common phrase “hearth and home” for a substitution, the “letter from the country of the wonderstone’s home” that you can see after climbing the 92 steps very well might be… the capital G in Germany. The masonic G that’s inside the compasses on the lampposts around the Grand Staircase.
No deep dive required.

Kalessin

(I don’t think I’ve seen this proposed meaning of these lines in this 160-page thread…)
“You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth”
In “The Secret” book, on page 7 (the page number is cut off in the “OCR” PDF version of the book, it’s the second page of “The Tale Simply Told”), and again on page 30, the fair folk’s treasures, the gemstones, are defined as “wonderstones”.
In The Litany of the Jewels, the wonderstone of Germany is amethyst. The jewel in Image 10, which is already very strongly associated with Verse 8, is amethyst.
Guessing that Byron Preiss used the common phrase “hearth and home” for a substitution, the “letter from the country of the wonderstone’s home” that you can see after climbing the 92 steps very well might be… the capital G in Germany. The masonic G that’s inside the compasses on the lampposts around the Grand Staircase.
No deep dive required.

the only thing is youre not right lol. wonderstone is from SOUTH AFRICA. so the letterS are S and A, that is a reference (hint) to the compass clue in that puzzle. but the answer to the verse clue is definitely SA.

btw dont listen to malted he has no idea whats going on.

maltedfalcon

never been one for thinking there were any clues in the rest of the book.
I think that BP as editor might have changed a word here and there. but I don’t think any of it is useful as clues.

I think that there’s some clue information in there, and a whole lot of storytelling fluff. There’s also a number of bits and pieces of illustration that show up slightly altered in the JJP paintings.

no youre not. google it. that is beyond an absurd statement i just told you what both mean. i know what im doing. you dont have to trust me, but that would be a mistake on your part. not mine.

JoshCornell

the only thing is youre not right lol. wonderstone is from SOUTH AFRICA. so the letterS are S and A, that is a reference (hint) to the compass clue in that puzzle. but the answer to the verse clue is definitely SA.

Josh, since neither of us has the Image 10/Verse 8 casque in hand, I’m as right about the clues as you are.

you know i know where it is right? i mean, ive already told everyone the location and everything. its just a matter of getting there, which i dont plan nor care to do really. im giving you the answer. reject it at your own peril…
btw youre definitely not as right as i am, cause i know what im doing…you clearly dont. no offense. it is what it is.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrophyllite

read it and weap gg, ya little biznatch

JoshCornell

the only thing is youre not right lol. wonderstone is from SOUTH AFRICA. so the letterS are S and A, that is a reference (hint) to the compass clue in that puzzle. but the answer to the verse clue is definitely SA.

Which sounds more like the defining part of a clue:
(1) A reference to “wonderstones” as the Fair Folk name for the jewels in the section that talks about the Fair Folk countries of origin, and a verse reference to “wonderstone’s country” , all in the pages of the same book, The Secret.
(2) A reference to “wonderstone” in South Africa found via google (which didn’t exist when the puzzles were created, but one could of course use a library), which is also found in other places like Namibia and the USA (Utah, California, and Nevada).
Josh, since neither of us has the Image 10/Verse 8 casque in hand, I’m as right about the clues as you are.

JoshCornell

btw youre definitely not as right as i am…..

JoshCornell

reject it at your own peril…

Yeah. “I’m right, you’re wrong.”
Nyah, nyah, nyah….pbbbbbbppptttt.
=P
O_o

look dude. if you get it you get it, if you dont you just dont. do you think your shit talking hurts me? it doesnt phase me in the slightest, though i will defend myself so that your attempts to smear me to others are checked
anyways. there are two countries that have more than one word that produce wonderstone USA and SA…both have SA. however, to get to that damn point in the puzzle…you will have had to made the reading of an earlier clue via a marketing reading of the verse clue (to get you to Kenwood) you learn about this (are hinted towards) the reading of this clue when you visit the italian renaissance house built by adler which has a set of VERY CLOSE to 92 stairs (i couldnt bw 82-96 based on which sets you include)…you know its a staircase cause you would have already learned about the grand staircase in the mitchell mansion (now wisconsin club and adorned with lions), which you are taken to via the awning in the cape and first verse clue. in this museum there is a section about the advertising campaigns used by the family who lived there. therefore we know we are to read the clue in a marketing sense. and thus, it applies to the wonderstone marketed for sculptures, particularly, coming from south africa. therfore we are looking for an S or an A. (if you make wrong reading you see A on ground…there is both an S and A on the ground in the location and an A up on the building…)
it’s not rocket science… (wait…sometimes it actually is…XD…)…

My goodness… what about Namibian wonderstone? Namibia also being in Africa and everything…

Clearly a ref to this, via a clue from Hollywood/LA that I just recently broke. So good.
^does a little dance^

see prev post i covered that.

JoshCornell

in this museum there is a section about the advertising campaigns used by the family who lived there. therefore we know we are to read the clue in a marketing sense.

because we all know Museums never update/change / add or remove sections. we can assume that this obscure section was there at the time and included as an important clue by BP.

Careful guys.
He’s right, you’re wrong and posting anything to the contrary places you in….
PeRrRRrrRiL! ! !.
*cue ominous music*
Dunn-dun-duuuuuunnnn!

JoshCornell

see prev post i covered that.

The verse also says “A letter from the country” not “Two letters” or “More than one letter” or whatever.

animal_painter,
i love reading all your research and pictures for the park.  sorry i have not had any input, i just got stuck, it seemed it had to be the lion bridges.
plus, not having much time anymore, it’s hard to focus on one image or verse.  and somehow i miss some posts even when i think i’ve caught up
going over the verse again i think we all agree up to “after climbing the grand 200”
then it gets murky.
the part “southeast over rock and soil” makes me think of the indian mounds, but that would be going opposite of the lion bridges. but then “pass the compass” could mean “circle around”………..i think
but maybe that is for “the meadow” or the “golf course”, except i don’t think of rocks being in meadows…
synonyms for meadow are:  greens, range, field
which makes me think of the bowling greens and the greens on the golf course.
isn’t one of the girl scout markers near there? maybe it’s just the 5th tree from the bowling greens or golf course.
the only other thing i’ve thought about is in the cloak, that could be the lighthouse on the far right, not sure what that dark indention is meant to portray….but now boogieman has me seeing letters in the cloak like in image 12
just for laughs…when i say rock and soil several times, i think of rock and roll….music, don’t they have concerts in the meadow?

I’ve been thinking about this verse and can’t get the woman and the harpsichord out of my head so I will take another stab at an interpretation.  I think the woman and the harpsichord are different clues.
View the three stories of Mitchell
The Mitchell Hall building at the corner of Downer and Kenwood Blvd.
As you walk the beating of the world
A reference to the synagogue that was across the street from Mitchell Hall.
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
A reference to N. Downer Ave., N. Hackett Ave., and N. Sheppard Ave which were all named for people who lived in Milwaukee and which cross Kenwood Blvd.
At a distance in space
From woman,
I think this just refers to the last street (Marietta Ave.) you have to cross before you get to Lake Park.  So as you view Mitchell Hall you have to pass 3 streets (named for people who lived in Milwaukee) that are a temporal distance from you and one street (named for a woman) that is a spatial distance from you.
This doesn’t help us locate the casque but I think it narrows down the location where we might find the silent harpsichord.  As all the clues(as far as we know) are in order it would put the harpsichord somewhere between Marietta Ave and the Grand Staircase.  And as I think the next lines go together I think the silent harpsichord will be in the park.
with harpsichord
Silently playing
Step on nature
Cast in copper
One should enter the park (step on nature) on LMD (cast in copper) while looking for a silent harpsichord
Anyway just a thought….

Wikipedia:
“The only painting that can be conclusively attributed to Marietta Robusti is her Self Portrait (c. 1580; Uffizi Gallery, Florence). This portrait depicts
Marietta posed before a harpsichord
, holding a musical text that has been identified as a madrigal by Philippe Verdelot, ‘Madonna per voi ardo’.”

Great armchair-treasure-hunting….
Love the painting….It keeps us right in the Lake Park vicinity.
AP

Here are a couple of pics that I don’t know if they have been posted here, but I thought they might help. I can’t remember where I picked them up from. The first is a map the old girl scout trail around the lighthouse at the time (I also have one plotting all the Girl Scout signs on the trees along the path), the second is what I had always considered the 100 paces:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/r8drl8p4tl910cx/2638187808_d3c74426a0.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ewbdvyx2x0jq25u/100%20paces%20sign.png?dl=0

How would the Bridge and Culvert fit in to this location?

I dont know.

There should be a beer reference somewhere in this Milwaukee puzz.
Edit: for the record, I think the “4-trunk tree” shape in the cloak is actually the wrinkled boot on the statue of Kosciuszko in connection with a tall tale theme about lifting yourself up by your boot straps which would explain hopping from place to place around the city.
Doubledit: I also cant help thinking of distance in space and time as a nod to Time Bandits.

Saw this today….
Interesting….
http://www.mediafire.com/view/zprzxonkd68s3d4/dig.jpg

decibalnyc,
A couple of your questions can be answered…
The verse says to “pass the compass”.
About 10 years ago, the North Point Lighthouse was
completely renovated and remodeled. This
included the grounds and parking area.
Before the updating, there was a walkway
around the North side of the lighthouse.
If you walked on the pavement from the golf course
parking lot, along the edge of the golf course, over
the North Lion Bridge…you could bear right when
you reached the area between the two Lion Bridges
and take the walkway around the back of the
lighthouse and “pass” it on its North side…
until you reached N Wahl Ave.
That is where you enter the North Ravine.
This is the beginning or “foot” of the ravine.
You can call it a culvert because it is a trough
that passes under a railway or bridge.
As for the significance of the use of the words
“over rock and soil”…
There is a trail under each Lion Bridge.
The South Ravine trail steps are created
using wooden timbers and dirt.
The North Ravine trail steps are created
using rocks and dirt.
This would mean that you are taking the
100 paces under the bridge in the
North Ravine.
Hope this helps clarify some of the verse.
AP

Hey I know that tree!

I can’t really see ‘foot’ as ‘top’. But…are you saying the 100 paces start from the top…?

WhiteRabbit,
I can see the “foot of a hill” or the “foot of a tree” as being
the outside edge or the beginning of the object.
If you wanted to, you could go directly to the low part of
the ravine (precariously making your way down the sloping side)
as you just pass the lighthouse. Then the word “foot” could mean
“the low point” of the culvert. Either way, you would still find
yourself in the ravine…making your way to “below the bridge”.
Taking the trail is safer.
As for the 100 paces…
We are told to start counting them from “below the bridge”.
Those paces appear to take us to the end of the ravine.
AP

Ah, OK. Cheers. I thought 100 paces from the bridge was said to take you across the road though…?

We can’t yet be certain which compass is being passed, or which sense to utilize the word “pass”.
By walking, I could pass by a place that is named North Point Lighthouse, which entertains the notion that a compass is something that points north.
I could simply transfer an object, like a directional compass or a draft compass from my hand to your hand, which you can then use to find a heading or draw a circle on a map.

I’ve really been researching a lot of things tonight…here is what I am having hangups on with the Lake Park solution…not only the original dig site which I took a picture near today, but also shadowrunner’s revised version.
Original Dig
This is assuming BP considered a culvert to be a natural made ditch…really a culvert is something that diverts water underneath land like a pipe under a road…so in essence a bridge could be the land over the drainage, but lets assume he meant what we all take him to mean in this scenario which is the ditch that runs under the 2nd lions bridge past the lighthouse….which incidentally is where I was able to notice the drain and the newly dug up hole as well as the wooden foot bridge below. From the drain by the dig site (lowest spot), 100 paces southeast puts you across LMD…examining this more and I know anyone who has been through this has been at this point many times….
Pass the compass and reach – North Point is the only thing I can attribute to this, but what about “reach” ? How do you pass the compass…because you can go around it 2?
The foot of the culvert – which one, lets assume the one south of the light house
Below the bridge – which one? lets assume the southern one
Walk 100 paces – OK
over rock and soil – why the significance of this line? why is he telling us this, it must be important…is there 2 ways to walk?
To the first young birch – problem is you come this way by not the first young birch, but the largest cottonwood…even though we assumed that BP didn’t know his trees…it still puts you in the wrong spot.
If you were to come out on the path with the stairs by the benches then that largest tree by the ditch would be the 5th, but there is no “letter from the country” on the 5th, I don’t think BP would have considered a knothole that kinda looks like a D a letter…is there any other case of this? Granted I have always thought that tree matched the cape, and the foot sorta looks like the picture…but I stood in that spot for 30 minutes today just looking at the picture and EVERYTHING I could see from that location and it just doesn’t click…taking into consideration the time that has passed, I just don’t see enough overwhelming evidence…I see 1 maybe 2 similarities to the picture, but the chest pattern isn’t anywhere, nothing else in the picture resembles anything in that spot except the pattern on the cape foot and the tree… you can see the hoan bridge from there, but that’s about it.
With shadowriders theory, well you don’t pass the compass, unless there is another compass we missed…but he found some birch trees!
One thing I will say about the cape image…there are what looks like 4 trees in a cluster, or 3 trees with a streetlamp in the distance….these trees appear to be numbered by horizontal lines in them…2, 3, and 4….are these the “Pass Three”?
Also the pattern on the neck bothers me, and it always has…that design is on the Pabst Theater yet I haven’t seen it anywhere else, not on lattice work or bridges….with the city hall image, was it also necessary to invoke the Pabst (and by the way, there’s your beer reference)?
When I stand at Juneau Park, there is at least a solid 100% visual clue, but to get from the north point lighthouse to there is quite a haul and leaves a big gap in the verse…and right when it seems you are getting close…still hard to ignore. Other than the large cottonwood tree looking similar to the cape foot, what else is there. The cape shoulder trees are found just about everywhere along lake park…to see a 3 branch or 3 trunk tree growing at that angle, next to a pair like seen in the illustration is so common I thought I saw that layout several times today. I believe there were some more obvious markers at the dig spot for Cleveland and Chicago.
The only thing I can think of is re-interpret the verse even more literal. Again, just brainstorming here…but lets start with the first word…
VIEW – to look at something
Three Stories….is this a building…. or a book or a collection of facts about the Mitchell family?
Thinking downtown as this is where city hall and the Pabst Theater is…other than the grand avenue mall (which I agree has a compass and a staircase with 92 steps and is located at 200 Wisconsin or Grand Aveune) what else could be considered the Grand 200…I just don’t see it….also what I can’t believe is that the plaque on the Juneau Statue and the match to the hand and head of the P10 is a coincidence…also that he is a Leo the 5th sign of the zodiac and the statue is one of the tallest on the lakefront…but even to reverse engineer it…there has to be a bridge near that has a culvert.
I have lived here for a long time and just can’t see how it wouldn’t mean the grand staircase, but again…back to the argument of either BP knew his trees or he didn’t.
I’ll be glad when I can get the GPR on all of the suspected spots and start ruling them out one by one.

I think BP found the 200 Grand Avenue site of the Plankington Arcade and then discovered that he could set a compass to 200 degrees (while setting the 0/360 to true North) and drawing a line at the center of those stairs takes you within 100 paces of the NW corner of Kosciuszko Park.
You can argue that this is just wrong and any other option is more favorable, or you can say it’s too complicated because it requires compass manipulation and the use of a standard city map, or you can simply say it’s cool to pick the address of 200 and Grand Ave, and discover you can also set a compass to 200 degrees for a directional heading.
The 100 paces of rock and soil then must be the SE diagonal heading over the playfield of the Kosciuszko Montessori school. It’s a raised grade playfield and according to code standards of landscape construction, of which I’ve reviewed only in a general fashion and have no idea how these have changed over the years, and such standards include specifications of laying rock aggregate of a certain size and layer thickness, grading (to level it out), and then follow that with a layer of soil also of certain specifications like percentage of clay, loam, and organic material which again is graded and seeded. I think a playfield works great as a literal representation of “over rock and soil”.

digger7, how long has that lighthouse sign that says it used to be “100” feet away been there? i think that’s to let you know you’re going the right way. ‘m liking the lion’s bridge, behind the 5th rail,

Perhaps a “letter from the country” implies a STAMP of sorts.  In a different sense, what kind of things are known to “stamp”?  Would that pertain to any kind of animal or just ones with hooves?  I’m thinking of the word “stampede” as in a cattle stampede.
Does this look like a possibility?
The Kosciuszko Equestrian Statue off of Lincoln Ave which I believe makes a good case for a “Proud tall fifth” as he is a 1-star General (Generals may have up to 5-stars, and so 1/5 = fifth)

“Letter from the country” could imply stamp,
yet it could also imply post, postal, envelope, stationary /stationery , address, RFD, rural, Mail/male and a myriad of other words.
before you fixate on stamp, explain what clue in the verse or image, indicates that word as opposed to any of the others.

I still have some problems to work out with the juggled verse.
I’m thinking back to street names.  If “beating of the whirled” is Kenwood, then we shouldn’t expect any of the lines to behave any differently.  “Southeast over rock and soil” might be Water which typically flows over such material as rock and soil.  “At a distance” could be the word Prospect which means “to look at a distance”.  Lots of possibilities still need to be considered.
Cast on copper, might not connect with Lincoln Memorial Drive but with Lincoln Avenue instead.
Step on nature, the Oakleaf trail runs along the Lake Park to Downtown route already.  It doesn’t make sense to call attention to both if they both parallel each other.

I don’t know the area well enough to really have a good opinion.
But I have seen that in  the two found casques the verses were completely linear
starting from the iconic image and ending at the casque.
While I havent found the casque in SF, using this methodology alone, helped me discover the lincoln park site, that I am sure holds or held the SF casque at one time. Assuming the verse was linear got me further along than I had been for many many years.
So by starting at city hall in the view from image and head toward the east. the point where you cross from urban to park, fits perfectly “Step on nature” So Id feel resonably confident that this verse also is linear.

What do folks think of this attempt to juggle the verse?  I start on Kenwood, see Mitchell Hall, take Lincoln to the Grand Stair, ascend, walk 100 paces southeast to the parking lot that puts you on Oakleaf trail (step onto nature) pass the lighthouse, the bridge and the culvert (while not exactly climbing down into the ravine, just peering down to see it) and then *poof* At a distance in time and space…find Cityhall, continue southeast to Kosy Park, find the birches, and then find the tree that matches the outline in the cape, it’s along the edge of the street near St. Josephat.  Perhaps there’s a woman and harpsichord organ associated with that church.
Maybe the line “southeast over rock and soil” follows the line “Below the bridge” instead.

Wonderstone… I wonder… could this be a literary reference from an author who writings shared similar topics?
Walter de la Mare (1873–1956)
English poet and writer.
“All de la Mare’s short stories and longer prose works are touched with mystery, if not fantasy. The two recurrent themes are the child’s vision of the world, and death; the usual setting is an unspecified candle‐lit, horse‐drawn age; houses are old, many‐roomed and have secrets. The characters often seem to have strayed from another world, or to be in close contact with it, and many of his stories touch on ghostly visitations. Though his verse
often deals with conventional fairy matters—witches on broomsticks, fairy dancers, elves, will‐o’‐the‐wisps,
he is far more oblique in his fiction.”
In 1910 Walter de la Mare wrote The Three Mulla‐Mullgars.
“The Three Mulla‐Mullgars is the story of
a spiritual quest
, from life to death. The three little monkeys set out to find the Valleys of
Tishnar
, the kingdom from which their father had originally come and for which he has departed. Nod, the folkloristic youngest son, who is also the leader, is entrusted with the talismanic
Wonderstone
. In the
journey ‘beyond and beyond, forest and river, forest, swamp and river, the mountains of Arakkkabao—leagues and leagues’
they encounter strange and wonderful animals, among them the spirit of evil, the menacing Immanala—‘she who preys across the shadows’, and survive terrifying perils, including the loss of the Wonderstone, wheedled from Nod by a seductive Water Maiden. Though the last few pages are anticlimactic, even weak compared to what has gone before, it is the most magical and original of all de la Mare’s stories.”

Elisabeth Chojnacka is amazing at harpsichord.

The architecture of the Bank at 10th and Mitchell is very interesting.  I think its a candidate for the line about a culvert.

No problem.  I have only ever been there for football games, concerts, and the State Fair, so it was fun to walk around while the place was empty.  I’m glad you like the pics.  FWIW, I used an inexpensive Sony digital camera.  Don’t give up!

At a distance in time
I still favor the word “prospect” as a swap for “at a distance”.  The word’s “in time” could take on a literal meaning such as the Clock Tower Acres where you would take 2nd street which actually passes through the building that’s built over the roadway.  The result is literally traveling into “time” and then out of “time” as you pass through that threshold.
Time could also be less to do with a clock and more to do with a period or interval.  Perhaps a bank, a place that operates primarily on the basis of giving loans, which are repaid over time.
If the preceding or following line could give hint to a bank, then I’d be more into that perspective.

At a distance in time,
At a distance in space,
Some distance along “second” street, passing through the Clock Tower Acres.  An Acre is a measure of space.
Im a bit hazy on the particulars with how this journey starts in Lake Park and gets to W. Lincoln Ave., but thats what I’m tying to figure out.

I just want to rehash some things about this verse. Being that there are multiple theories about the “Starting Point” if it is even a linear puzzle, and since Siskel and Egbert have told us that the verse will take you directly to the spot, I think we should go over this verse one more time. I just want to break this down to non specific terms and though this might seem redundant, I think it might open up some new thinking.
We already have a solid theory put forth and tested by Forest, Pine and AP and others back in 2006 at Lake Park. I also have a downtown suspicion, and others have a Kozy park theory. No one has found anything solid yet. Some very good theories, a set of stairs, a good BP representation of the Compass, and a cottonwood tree which closely matches the image aren’t discounted, maybe the dig was off a bit, but I’ve seen the pictures, that was a LARGE excavation. LP is the most accepted theory, but if we were to re-examine it…
Keeping in mind what we know now about methodology, it wouldn’t hurt to go over the verse once again. I have a new theory and what I feel might be the key to lock in some kind of starting area for locating the right bridge. This came to me over an August 1980 expo on Milwaukee in National Geographic Magazine. Consider the popularity of Nat Geo magazine in the late 70’s and 80’s. I suspect BP as well as many other Americans read this article. It was a cover story, a 22 page expose on the city, origins, history, etc… It gave a specific breakdown of the 3 settlements from the early 1800’s that eventually formed the city of Milwaukee (at a distance in time from 3 who lived there) Kilbourn, Juneau, and Walker. The article also provides this map.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/o3hgraotizg95ie/map.png?dl=0
Reading more, the article also tells of the 3 brewery moguls Pabst, Schlitz, and Miller. I feel this line, as WELL as the line “View the three stories of Mitchell” may only signify Milwaukee, enough for you to match the image with the verse. The Mitchell Gardens (or Domes) as they are known as, was a top tourist attraction through the 70’s and 80’s with a rich history.
View the 3 stories of Mitchell – This seems like it’s referencing a starting point, but perhaps it’s only to signify Milwaukee – enough for you to match the verse and image.
The line “As you walk the beating of the world”, seems to signify a street…Wells or Kenwood or maybe something else.
I am somewhat convinced that due to the history of the city, the lines
“At a distance in time from three who lived there”
are a reference to the same information in the Nat Geo article, referring to the founders of the city.
If this is narrowing the area down it would be the walkers point / downtown / points east area
That leaves us with
At a distance in space – From woman – With harpsichord silently playing
After this the instructions start to become more direct.
So WHAT IF, the above line about the woman is narrowing the area down a little bit more. The best and really the ONLY idea’s anyone has had about this line so far are citing a possible painting hanging in the Hotel Wisconsin, and Marietta Robusti as a very obscure reference to Marietta St. near lake park. I thought as the Pabst Theater was known as “The Grand Old Lady” and had a Lire (resembling a harp) on top, it was also a contender. None of these idea’s, even my own, seems correct. Does anyone have any thoughts on this line other than what has been discussed previously? It could allude to an area of town, a street, landmark, or anything else. It seems to be the last of the vague clues on this verse, and no one has really had anything solid on it for 10 years.
As discussed in the methodology forum, and as many of us agree that the first part of the verse gets you to a starting point, and the last part kind of zero’s in on the exact spot…could we apply some thinking to this line, in those regards? I know the area’s of the city fairly well since the 80’s… AP also has extensive history here. I think we’d be happy to answer any questions about parts of town or landmarks etc…
So any idea’s about that line?

Also I don’t know if this has been brought up, there is a statue in Cathedral Square Park, just off Wells and Jefferson across from the fountain is the Immigrant Mother statue, which bears some resemblance to the image in how the hood angles to the left at the bottom. Ironically this statue was made by Ivan Mestrovic, the same creator of the Spearman and the Bowman in Chicago.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigrant_ … ulpture%29

I caught that connection in sculptor work, but I couldnt bring myself to bend the verse that far.
When I get down to it, Id like to make sense out of each individual piece as a thing selected by that particular Fair Folk for its purpose in representing their appeal for each jewel. In Milwaukee I am concerned mostly with qualities of the amethyst, which is rectangular, purplish, imperial and star. I think the dwarves liked beer, exploration, and militarism. They liked HG Wells story telling. They blended in with the culture brought by the city founders. They admired City Hall from nearby Pabst Theater. They admired the statues of Generals.

And they liked wonderstone…a beautiful mineral when tumble polished.

The likelyhood that a worker found the casque is very likely. They would not know what it was and keep it or sell it to an antique dealer. One way to find this is out is either us or the park manager send an e-mail to all the construction companies that put up the wall explaining the situation and asking them to see if anyone that worked on the project found the casque. Another area to exsplore is former park managers they have likely gone through several sence the time the wall was constructed. If a worker did find the casque they may have showen it to the park manager who let them keep it.
Another possibility if you could find someone that had the technology is to use ground penatrateing rader on the concrete to see what can be found. You may be able to talk the park into letting you jackhammer up a small amount of concrete if you know something definate and agree to put it back at your exspence.

Cost to rent jackhammer, air compressor and hose, plus $150.00 deposit:
$254.00
Cost of  3 yards replacement concrete, at $65/square yard:
$195.00
Cost of citation from city when you jackhammer up a piece of a public park:
$1000.00
Finding out you had the wrong location for a prize worth no more than $100 in the first place:
Priceless.
(LOL…all in fun, folks!)

Nice work…I think the 2 best finds would be the neck image by UWM….I would verify that it existed in 1982, and the 92 stairs at the library…unfortunately that doesn’t explain “The Grand 200” just yet, but there are a set of eagles on the outside of the library that might come into play.
That might be a reach for the compass at city hall…it does look as if it’s pointing NSEW, but the only if you know your bearings…also even though there is a 92 step spiral staircase leading to the observation deck in city hall where you find the Juneau bell, I still have my concerns about him taking us indoors….so far the strangest place he’s taken us is on a ferry boat.
All good observations, possibly the answer to your rebus question is this…
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ogf5x6n18c9ip … K.png?dl=0

Also it should be mentioned the oval track is a 1/5 mile track not a standard 1/4 mile.

After a long hiatus, I am back in the game.
I haven’t even touched the message boards here since the end of summer when grad school started. I wanted to concentrate on school, and not get to caught up in the hunt. That said, since I am on winter break, I got the itch and caught up on the 25+ pages I missed on on verse 8 and Image 10. While I’ve been gone, it looks like my Wisconsin Club discovery picked up some traction. I am really glad about this as I feel this is one of the most solid leads that anyone on the boards has found yet. A big thanks to lengrano for giving it the bump it needed and building a really solid theory around it.
Before I get to all of those pages of posts, I also want to give my friend J_Galt a shout since he has gone location scouting with me a few times now and we have formed somewhat of a team. Also decibalnyc gets a lot of my admiration for a ton of creative problem solving with this puzzle and getting the ball rolling on using GPR in some of the suspected dig sites. Likewise, erexere – keep spinning those wheels, you’re our way outside the box thinker and you have certainly inspired a theory or two of mine thus far. Also, if otteriffic is still out their someplace, thanks for driving in from Madison and confirming some of the things I was seeing. Lastly – a big thanks to crashdome for suggesting we all take a look at some older maps at
http://county.milwaukee.gov/mclio/geodata/imagery.html
. This was a huge help in confirming what things looked like 30 or so years back.
All this being said there are new things I have noticed while reviewing all of those posts. I’m not sure that I have a decisive theory, but a bunch of little revelations that might help push this hunt forward. So without further ado;
———————————————————————————————-
RANDOM:
Here are some old images of a few of the parks in question… maybe they will help someone.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 691162324/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 312727412/
Also, I think these theories/ discoveries by others have merit and dersearve a little more exploration:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 313767675/
(Woman playing a harpsichord owned by the pabst mansion)
The neck image here looks similar to the clock hand to me…
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126219048/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 312708022/
————————————————————————————-
MY OWN IDEAS (FROM LEAST TO MOST LIKELY):
1. From the intro of the book:
A proud tall fifth might refer to the 5 fairy nation to arrive in the new world (from Ireland)
– 5 Sidhe, Leprechauns, Fir Darrigs
2. There has been a Grand staircase inside the lobby of the Hilton Garden Inn Milwaukee Downtown since 1886.
3. Young Birch is a Robert Frost Poem – Probably just a coincidence, but since there is a possibility that war of the world’s plays into one of the clues (well’s street/beating of the world), I thought I would also mention it in case this puzzle is full of literary references.
4. Something has bugged me for a long time about the 1,3,5 at the end of the verse. This is a clear number sequence like you would have gotten on the ACT… usually you would then have to finish the sequence or figure out how the two sequences were related. This is one way that the birch doesn’t have to be an actual tree, if the numbers are the actual important thing. The numbers might alternatively be a code or equation of some kind.
3
3
92
200
100
1
3
5
5. The entrance of Lake Park is refered to as the “Grand Entrance” and looks like this:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 287812016/
(flowers?)
6. Key – Walking stick – Millstone
I have some questions about this…
Why is this backwards? Is this a clue to go through the verse in reverse order?
Is there a reason the flower is placed in between the key and the Walking stick?
Could this be a clue that the image needs to be flipped to make the “map” work?
7. In terms of the pattern on the woman’s neck, I have also seen it at the fire house on KK in bay view.
(they aren’t their on google street view though, so these might be a newer addition)
Likewise there is a similar symbol on the wall of the restaurant across from UWM’s Mitchell hall.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 693869843/
There are also weird people on the roof that may have some significance.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … otostream/
8. In the figures hairline there is a shape. decibalnyc suggested a while back that the shape might be the Hoan bridge. This got me to thinking that rather than a bird’s eye view – that the edge of the figure might instead actually be a silhouette of the skyline – with the blue denoting which side the water is on (take a look at google maps in satellite mode). This means however that it will need to be “unraveled” in some way to align with a map. Once this is done, the glowing ball shape might produce a location to look in. I was able to get the odd notch in the cape to line up really well in this way with part of the water line and this places the ball very close to the Mitchel park domes. Maybe we are supposed to travel from the Wisconsin club to the domes? I have always thought that there was a map hidden in this image somehow.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126023318/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 311476171/
Also these views for comparison:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 313769705/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126031498/
(notice the smoke stack)
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 311981901/
(maybe the robe line?)
9. Some other Dome ideas. The Mitchell Park Nature Conservatory (the domes) could be another play on words that was used since there are also conservatories for music. In this case, there would be no music, hence the silence.
Not sure how the harpsichord or woman plays into this except that the domes are referred to as the three breasted woman. Also, Primrose (and many other flowers) grow at the Mitchel park domes.
Also, this is there:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 311965311/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Vieau
10. There is a compass that no one has mentioned on the floor of city hall:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126210690/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 287651106/
Likewise, the landing of the grand staircase at the lakefront may have been decorated in a compass like fashion at one time:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 311786021/
11. This one is quite significant and was discovered by J_Galt and confirmed by a worker at the library. The grand rotunda of the Milwaukee Public library ALSO has 92 stairs. Damn you Milwaukee and your consistent stair counts. We have yet to explore this further.
———————————————————————————–
And finally… My favorite idea for a dig spot.
decibalnyc I would love to come with you to GPR this spot…
Here is an old pic of Pere Marquette:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 287839576/
There is a tree in Pere Marquette Park that fits the outline of the cape almost perfectly.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126024558/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126188650/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 693689623/
It also happens to be at the southern foot of a bridge in a spot that is partially concealed to view. You can also see the Usingers sign (“U”) plainly between the trees from the south side.
Did I mention that the bridge has a culvert underneath it and bells on its control towers. Oh, and it also would have been almost a perfect match to the view of city hall in the illustration before the PAC was built (after 1982 btw).
Also, coincidentally the historical society building is strikingly similar to that of a harpsichord.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 127895347/
I also referenced an old map of the park and there appears to be birch trees growing there in a similar configuration to what is currently onsite.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 287647916/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126188470/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 126187870/
My money says the cask is there.

The Ferry can also be bypassed, I’d be skeptical of anything that specifically requires a car or going indoors. Yes, you need a car to skip the ferry, but once you ‘get’ the clue you don’t have to physically ride the boat. You’d absolutely have to go inside for that one.

decibalnyc

I still have my concerns about him taking us indoors….so far the strangest place he’s taken us is on a ferry boat.

shecrab

um….in the interest of accuracy,
The Baum Ferry was not built or delivered to the state of North Carolina until 1995 and it does not run to Roanoke Island. The TA Baum ferry runs from Cape Hatteras to Ocracoke, well south of Roanoke Island.
The ferry
LINE
in North Carolina was operational in 1947, when the NC Highway commission bought the T.A. BAUM’s ferry
COMPANY
. At
that
time, the single ferry ran from Manns Harbor to Roanoke Island. Today, no ferry connect Roanoke I. with anything. Instead, there are two bridges–one of which is probably the same as that first ferry route.
The correct Baum item is the Washington-Baum Bridge–which connects the outer banks to Roanoke island on the other (East) side of the island. The route is US 64–this route connect Roanoke Island to the Mainland via the Virginia Dare Memorial Bridge. .

Obligatory reposting of the Standard Shecrab Correction
TM
:

Good fact checking. I mostly rely on maltedfalcon’s criticisms these days. Shecrab use to be a huge help to the hunt. She has been missed. People who understand the nuances of diction are a great resource. I have lots of trouble in that area.

Awesome post atomicleprechaun.
I intend to read that Frost poem…just to be sure.
I liked your take on the numbers being tied together somehow.
92 stair rotunda in the library too!? WTF Milwaukee.

Also, Roanoke is the only puzzle (that we know for as sure as we can be) where the distance between relevant clues and the treasure ground is too far to travel on foot. So “
Ride
the man of oz” could just be a subtle hint to that fact and not meant to be taken literally. All the other words Preiss uses are measures of foot travel (hop, step, walk, pace, etc), probably because either you can see the relevant clue from where you are standing (the Sutro Tower in SF for example), or you pass them on your pleasant little walk from Point A to Point T. If a clue isn’t obvious from ground level, then it’s probably not relevant to the puzzle IMO.

Right, so if we rule out the grand avenue mall and city hall, and we don’t find another match for the 92 stairs, we are left with Lake Park and the Mitchell Domes. Since the Domes have 92 steps, divided into 4 sections and no bridge over a culvert, we have to think that Lake Park is a pretty solid match…finding that neck symbol by UWM was a huge deal. Also has anyone considered that Mason St. which is only a block from Wells, turns into Lincoln Memorial Drive at the lake and if you follow it to the end, where do you end up…on Kenwood…so like the Roanoke puzzle, the stating point may be downtown. At a distance in time from 3 who lived there to me is referring either to the 3 Mitchells, or to the city founders, not streets, I am confident of that. The woman with harpsichord line has yet to be translated to anyone’s satisfaction. The biggest clue we have is 92 steps outside somewhere. Lake park meets that the best so far, and the verse does take you to a certain area, but we have not matched anything solid in lake park which is troubling. If he only gave us 2 trees to match for the park, we might have found 1 in the cottonwood tree but not everyone agree’s. And what of this bird in the lower left?
GPR day will be sometime in mid-late Feb. If anyone wants to meet up, let me know. Until then, start figuring out some dig spots that we can put the radar on.

Also the problem with Pere Marquette Park, which I have examined closely every time I go to the Historical society, is that if you were to walk 100 paces SE from under the bridge, you would be in the river. You could argue that the riverwalk runs sort of southeast (but more south) but then if you took the riverwalk 100 paces SE from the bridge you pass all 3 birches which are on the north side of the park. It’s a cool spot, and I have often tried to shoehorn an idea there, but I just don’t see it. I’ve also checked out the Juneau statue where we have the best match for the image so far, and that only leads you to in front of the war memorial looking for the area where the clump birch was at, and then the PTF, it seems we can find pieces that fit all over, but LP so far…has the verse matched up from the stairs on out.

Unknown

Unknown:
but we have not matched anything solid in lake park which is troubling

We have the tee markers, and a fairly close match between the Lion’s Bridge sentries and the juggler’s face. Coincidentally (or by design if you subscribe to the theory that the verses were written after Preiss had the corresponding image from Palencar in hand), that is the one part of the Milwaukee puzzle where you have a directional decision to make and where the verse isn’t explicit as to your next move. As I’ve said many times, I find it almost impossible to believe that the red balls in the image are not representative of the tee markers on the golf course, and the only way we can incorporate them into the solve is to go south at the top of the GS, around the pavilion, and toward the lighthouse. The lions would be further confirmation that you are on the right path, at which point, the verse takes over again and tells you everything else you need to know to dig up the casque.

Oh yea, I forgot about the Tee Balls, that was my find a long time ago duh! Thanks Renovator! Also I was thinking about the top of the staircase, I like MF’s theory about the way the hand is pointing…left, so you would go left at the top of the stairs when the verse is unclear, yet you are 🙂

Sadly most of Varins pics were not available. The thumbs showed she took very comprehensive pics.
Maybe someone else will go and photograph the area.

Has anyone ever assessed the Marine Bank building on water st. for having the same architect and also owner for the Mitchell Mansion on 9th and Wisconsin?

i have pics of it, i didnt go inside though. i dont think youd need to go inside though. def supposed to go inside pabst mansion. mitchell mansion isnt accessible to public. are you talking about the one with the lions and eagles on it?

Ooh, just found that Silverberg collaborated with Preiss on a project.  The Ultimate Dinosaur (1992).  It might be assumed they were chummy enough a decade previous that it was cool for Preiss to use a juggler/Valentine motif for use in the Milwaukee puzzle.

JoshCornell

i dont see how you guys think its any where other than by FSAB in Charleston…

I don’t think it leads to FSAB (or, FSAH)….or, Charleston.
I think Verse 8, when coupled with Image 10, leads to Lake Park and Milwaukee….and, I’m pretty sure you agree with the Milwaukee part of that statement, even if you think it leads to the south side of the N.P. Water Tower.
(Looks like you posted your comment about FSAB / Charleston in the wrong thread? Maybe?)

Unknown

Unknown:
Looks like you posted your comment about FSAB / Charleston in the wrong thread?

No doubt. But at this point, it’s easier to think about what goes on here more as a free-flowing conversation among a few people, and act accordingly. The organizing principles on which this forum was founded haven’t been relevant for at least six months.

Euhirudinea

No doubt. But at this point, it’s easier to think about what goes on here more as a free-flowing conversation among a few people, and act accordingly. The organizing principles on which this forum was founded haven’t been relevant for at least six months.

Yeah…but, I’m hopeful…
=]

i dont see how you guys think its any where other than by FSAB in Charleston…

Josh. Are you out of your mind? What makes you think that BP would be able to take a ferry out to Fort Sumter and bury a casque on what is arguably sacred ground to all those men that died there?
Dude, you are definitely on the wrong track…..just like Houston, those aren’t train tracks in Image 8.

wtf are you on? fsab is across from wpg…

Unknown

Unknown:
i dont see how you guys think its any where other than…

Pay attention Josh, it’s not that hard to understand. Until the casque is dug up, “any where other than” incredulity can only rightfully be applied to the Cleveland and Chicago casques. It would be a boon to your cause if you showed even the most basic understanding of this concept.

JoshCornell

wtf are you on? fsab is across from wpg…

In my world FSAB means Fort Sumter Army Base. What color is the sky in your world?

Unknown

Unknown:
In my world FSAB means Fort Sumter Army Base.

What world is that? Certainly not one recognized by Google, where the most common hit is for Fort Sumter National Monument, the name it has gone by since 1948. In all fairness to Josh, his Charleston solve leads him to a patch of ground in front of the Fort Sumter Association House (FSAH), which is directly to the west of White Point Garden. He has never suggested that the casque was buried in or on the grounds of Fort Sumter as far as I know.
I don’t know what fsab is, but I’d imagine the “b” was a typo.

Alright. I’m going to Milwaukee this week. I’ll have a little time to check possible sites besides my own. Anyone that wants me to check on something let me know. Be specific though so I’m not chasing my tail. As of now I’ll be in Lake Park, Juneau Park (WR, I’ll check out the southern foot), and Kos Park.

I hope you find.

Enjoy. Take lots of pics!

Deuce, please point your camera at the following places:
1. E. State street and Water, facing south towards City Hall.
2. South side of Kosy Park standing on south side of tree just a few feet west of and across from Fiesta Garibaldi restaurant at 821 W. Lincoln Ave., point camera east towards St. Josaphat’s Belfry and point camera west towards the Thaddeus Kosciuszko statue.
Do you plan to probe?  If so, what are the specs of the tool?

ex, I will try to get those pics. Yes I got permission to probe. I have a fiberglass probe 48 inches long and half inch diameter. Shouldn’t be any deeper than 3.5 feet according to the book.

I have to admit, I haven’t worked on this verse/image a whole lot, but ponder it a bit. I also couldn’t find it mentioned yet that the North Bridge is 100 feet long. Perhaps this is why “paces” isn’t enumerated in any meaningful way… it would be clear. Or perhaps we just take 100 paces…
Sorry if I am just adding fluff.

FB,
Thank you.
AP

cw0909,
I did not make it to the “walk” on Sunday.
In the past, I have “stepped” off the distance from just below the
North Lion Bridge to the trail opening, to be 100 steps. The steps are actually
made of stones and dirt  (“rock and soil”), unlike the South Lion Bridge trail
which is made of timber and dirt.
I am trying to get to the lakefront this week to see if anything jumps out at me.
This time of year, everything is thick and green…and it makes it more
difficult to really “see the trees”.  The under-brush and thistles grow
several feet tall and remind me of a tropical jungle (I should take a machete!)
Forest B’s photos show a lot of changes since last year!
Why couldn’t BP have chosen to bury the casque near a “hardscape” instead of a tree?
AP

animal painter

Just ruminating on the word “pace”…
pace/pās/
Noun:
A single step taken when walking or running
.
It is 100 “steps” from just below the bridge
to the end of the North Lion Bridge Ravine.
Coincidence?
AP

are these what your talking about,and are both sets of steps a 100 count
here is the North Lion Bridge Ravine trail head:
http://kspot.org/trove/lakepark/DSC01272.jpg
http://kspot.org/trove/lakepark/DSC01273.jpg
From here I ascended the trail in the South Lion Bridge Ravine to its top, then descended, snapping photos:
http://kspot.org/trove/lakepark/DSC01287.jpg
http://kspot.org/trove/lakepark/DSC01288.jpg
FB thanks again for the pics

i too think you will find the casque AP
did you happen to make it to the history walk the 10th,and was it informative
regarding this hunt

erexere

I’ve been making the mistake of thinking of 1 pace as one step.  I think it’s more correct to use every other step distance which is about 2m.

pace = 1 step or about 30 inches.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pace

maltedfalcon

pace = 1 step or about 30 inches.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pace

That is definition 2.  Definition 3.c  says it’s 58.1 inches.  How screwed up is that?
Pace
n.
1. A step made in walking; a stride.
2. A unit of length equal to 30 inches (0.76 meter).
3. The distance spanned by a step or stride, especially:
a. The modern version of the Roman pace, measuring five English feet. Also called geometric pace.
b. Thirty inches at quick marching time or 36 at double time.
c. Five Roman feet or 58.1 English inches, measured from the point at which the heel of one foot is raised to the point at which it is set down again after an intervening step by the other foot

Okay, I’m taking a break from Verse 1 for a bit. This picture is amazing, and your discovery of the Milwaukee rebus was clever. I have some initial thoughts.
I agree with dan39decoy when he noted (6/21/04) that ‘Wonderstone’ refers to the jewel whose key casque is hidden. He added that ‘Wonderstone’s hearth’ probably refers to the country of the jewel’s origin (Germany, we think?).
Fox (5/30/04) noted, “It just doesn’t seem right. It tells you to climb (ascend) 92 steps after climbing 200 (more steps?) and then you reach the culvert.” I think they directions can be read either way. For example, “Ascend the 92 steps after you climb the grand 200” or “Ascend the 92 steps. Then, after you climb the grand 200…”. These two lines could also easily refer to the same set of steps, as long as “200” isn’t interpreted literally as a number (it’s okay if it is interpreted as CC). The latter interpretation is more in agreement with the steps in Lake Park, in which the “Grand Staircase” (‘grand 200’) consists of some of those 92/95 steps (after I typed that, I found that Pine Tree came to the same conclusion just last month, 5/6/05). To my mind, BP would have written ‘292’ rather than splitting it up into 92 and 200 if both numbers referred to steps. One of them is a play on words, pun, or visual reference. The fact that there is a sundial (compass?) near the top of the steps was the clincher for me.
I badly want to be able to say I recognize the girl’s hairline as the shoreline of Milwaukee, but I’m afraid I see no resemblance:

Ok, once again I find myself back in Piedmont Park in Atlanta.  Are any of our hunters from or near Atlanta?
Take a look at these pictures taken around (I believe the outsides or less traveled portions) Piedmont Park:
http://www.diff.net/media/2001_06_Piedmont_Park/
“Ascend the 92 steps”  I dont know if there are 92 but the last photo of the stairway appears to have atleast 80 steps.
“The foot of the culvert”  one photo actually shows a culvert..why..?…not sure since it isnt very pleasing to the eye.
“”Below the bridge”  The bridge photo obviously has a walking trail beneath it.
still searching for the nearby Compass and the statue/memorial/monument/plaque of or by a South African. (SA is wonderstone’s hearth).

I counted 5 sets of 10 stairs –
which is only 50  – unless there are several other unseen sets of stairs.

At least once in the opening pages, the book uses the term “wonderstone” as a catchall refering to each of the Fair Folk’s jewels.  I think it is highly possible that the reference in this verse is not refering specifically to a wonderstone (of South Africa or Utah), but to the actual jewel in its corresponding picture.  Knowing this would, of course, give you a specific country to find the letter thereof.

forest_blight

Much, or even all, of varin’s pictures are still available using the Internet Archive “Wayback Machine” (archive.org).

Thank you kindly, never heard of that site. I think I will go around saving these and putting all the pics in an easy to find album(s).

on that map that trohn posted, couldn’t the “over rock and soil” be the Indian mound, and then the road “locust” for birch, then i see newberry and 2 more roads (“pass three”)  (on the west side) that takes you to a path  to the lion bridges.

forest_blight

I believe that there is a remarkable amount of evidence in favor of the amethyst theory. Beyond simply conforming nicely to the country/birthmonth/stone/flower theme, consider what it would mean were it
not
an amethyst. 11 of the jewels would be birthstones that conform exactly to the theme …except for the one in P10. Why would JJP/BP do that deliberately? It makes no sense to have (e.g.) two sapphires when everything else conforms to the theme. When something clicks that well, you have to give it a certain amount of credence.
Why does it appear to be blue? I think you see this as deadly to the amethyst theory, but I don’t. I don’t believe it is a big stretch for what looks purple on a painting to translate poorly into an illustration in a mass-produced paperback (is purple really all that different from blue?). Colors in books often simply do not look like they do in person, if we were staring at the actual painting. It is much easier for me to believe that the coloring in the book is not 100% faithful to the original painting than it is for me to believe that one jewel violates a complex theme that makes perfect sense for all the other images.

Unknown

Unknown:
(is purple really all that different from blue?).

Unknown

Unknown:
Personally, I consider the “wonderstone’s hearth = Germany” idea speculative. It’s appealing, certainly, but far from definite. I don’t think I or anyone else meant to shoot down the proposal that it could mean something else, but of the many interpretations that have surfaced, it still makes the most sense to me that “wonderstone” refers to a jewel in a book that is all about hunting fairy jewels. “Wonderstone” is an apt way to describe such a thing. It could very well be a literal reference to a fireplace made out of wonderstone (rhyolite), but it seems to me that BP is trying to be cryptic and poetic here. It is a riddle, after all.

Unknown

Unknown:
I don’t want to squelch new ideas. But I think it’s fair to suggest that the new ideas have to lead somewhere if they are going to be useful. If you favor a particular idea, see where it takes you, share what you find, and we’ll debate it until the weaknesses are uncovered. It will either lead somewhere useful or it won’t.

Unknown

Unknown:
BTW, is it mainly the wonderstone and amethyst theories that you disagree with, or is it the broader claim that the P10 casque is in Milwaukee?

Unknown

Unknown:
Yes klbt, i did think the stories of mitchell refered to her house in atlanta. i also thought i had a pretty good solve for V1/P2 pairing being at the four corners monument. then the tie in to Herman Park was made, the outline of Charleston was discovered and my theory crashed and burned. i love the new ideas that come out daily. i have never, since latitude longitude_ birth month tie ins_ and city confirmers, even thought about them as anything else. lets stop the bickering, focus on the ‘unknowns’ and find another casque

I am not saying “I” don’t believe it’s an amethyst pictured in the painting–what I was saying was that when someone NEW looks at the painting, they are not going to see it as an amethyst because it’s definitely the wrong color. I found the attitude of superiority very rankling when comments were made about the painted jewel not being purple (previous comments–not yours.)  And yes, I see purple and blue as two very different colors, although they are in the “cool colors” family. If you say
then by reasonable inference, you’d have to say “is red all that different from purple?” or “is green all that different from yellow?”  I don’t like that kind of fuzzy logic, myself. Printing processes are not that “off”. They pretty much translate faithfully the colors the artist intended; for proof of that, look at any fine art painting in any museum, and then look at the photograph of it in a high-quality book and you’ll see what I mean. I only meant that we have the right to question something that isn’t correct–and that, for me, includes the color of the amethyst in the image.
True enough–but maybe not, too. Again–it’s not that these ideas are good OR exclusive–it’s the fact that it’s getting harder and harder to refute ideas that have been on this forum for a while because they are becoming proprietary. I say let’s rehash EVERYTHING. Let’s do it ALL over. It didn’t work the first time–so why not? So what if we bring up ideas that have been discarded? How many times did Edison do that before getting a device that finally worked? (Lots.)
As I said, if it didn’t lead to a find the first time, then (a) either something’s wrong with it, or (b) it’s lost and we can scratch off trying. No one here has ever suggested we stop trying. Not even in the Houston solution. So why groan about ideas you’ve heard before then? Or new ideas–
even when they don’t seem to lead anywhere obvious?
Neither one…I’m merely trying to say that we need to stop trying to dampen down those who get excited about this hunt and have ideas about it, even when they refute ideas that have been widely accepted as accurate or probable.
This is contrary to postings that have been put up here, Fox. You say this now, but that’s not the attitude you’ve had recently–or at times in the past. I’m not trying to single you out here, but if you really felt like this, wouldn’t you be less adamant about some ideas?
For instance, you stated that(in image 2) ‘since the outline of Charleston’—but if you look at a map, and take the latitude and longitude as some of the OTHER numbers in , you’ll end up at Niagara Falls Canada, and you can make almost everything in the verse that you have paired up with New York City and image 2 fit together for THAT location too. I did it when I first started working this. I’ve conceded to the Charleston location for now because I felt there were other things that were a better fit, but I still see image 2 and the NYC verse as paired–and can give quite a bit of evidence to support it,
even
the map! So as for things that are set in stone, I don’t believe anything is until a casque is found.

I only have one criticism of the idea for the place itself, which is that if it were beneath a tree, it would be extremely tough to dig very far down because of the root system…

Let me just put this out there, because I can sense that it is a point of contentin for the three people that have read my posts so far (Regulus, I’m not counting you in this because so far your posts have been based almost solely off of physical evidence that you yourself perceive): Trohn, Blight, and Fox: I do not WANT to find a treasure.  I want everyone else to find them.  My motivation in this respect is personal, and i will explain it further if you wish, but let it rest at that concept alone for now; I am establishing reasonable doubt about anything that is purported to be definite in an effort to stimulate critical thinking.  Before you try to tell me that I am being arrogant or something let me first point out (again) that I don’t want a casque for myself; I want it for all of you guys (everyone on the forum) because you’ve all put a lot of thought, and in some cases, work towards that end.  In other words, you guys deserve it.  Critical thinking is necessary because in order to find anything, you have to interpret quite a bit that is subjective: “what does the Harpsichord mean?”  “How many steps or feet are in a ‘pace?'” “How does one reach a specific spot where no path exists?”  You cannot deny that time and tide have ravaged the world since 1981.  As such, you cannot discount any possibility or observation as ‘silly’ or ‘irrelevant,’ especially when the original author of the “map” is a fantasy writer/publisher. If we can agree on that much, then allow me to continue, otherwise stop reading at this point.  I can take responsibility for any errors in fact, and thank you for being kind enough to correct them; I am only offering my own interpretations based off of extensive experience in intelligence gathering, land navigation, print manufacturing, and even a little bit from my years as a published writer and graphic artist.  I have, in fact, had to answer questions like “what does the color blue mean to you?” and “what symbol represents permanence to a specific culture?”  From the psychological perspective, it seriously helps to have someone question your perceptions of the evidence that is presented, in order to know what it…looks like you are thinking about doing…if that makes sense.  In summation, my experience lies mostly with manipulating other people’s perceptions in graphical and literary ways, of which I, once again, have extensive success.  Not that i am trying to ‘psych you out;’ I’m only trying to help you see how ambiguities can steer you in different directions than you intend.  This is not a lesson: it is an attempt to take you outside of 25 years of investigations that have yielded 1/6 of the intended assets.  I apologize for anything I’ve said that makes it seem otherwise.  Please continue to use whatever works best, and find something wonderful buried in the ground.  Again, you all deserve it, and I just want to watch people become triumphant.

The best proof is digging it up.
(To quote Roger Clemons – ‘How do you prove a negative?’)
** Thick skins only need apply. **
‘We’ are both a team and an individual.  For that, follow your logic and
your heart, and let all others be damned.
Let me just finally state the only obvious rule involved in this Secret:
Tell us if you find one.  (That’s it.)

And the unwritten rule: Don’t dig it up and leave a note that says: “Dear Forum Member: Let this be a lesson to you.”
Although, that would be pretty funny.  Funnier still if someone did that and spent their time writing posts that led directly to the spot…
Funnier STILL if the person made it tothe spot and found a shovel waiting for them.

Kuh-Lai-Bah-Ti

And the unwritten rule: Don’t dig it up and leave a note that says: “Dear Forum Member: Let this be a lesson to you.”
Although, that would be pretty funny.  Funnier still if someone did that and spent their time writing posts that led directly to the spot…
Funnier STILL if the person made it tothe spot and found a shovel waiting for them.

Funnier stilll, digging in the spot, and uncovering a copy of the book

Funnier still (?), going there, digging, and unearthing a golden hare.

KLBT,
Whille walking around the Lake Park on LMD, I kept
trying to think of any other object that BP could be
referring to…with his references to a “young birch”,
“pass 3” and see a letter on a “proud tall fifth”.
Then his saying that the treasure is at the “southern foot”,
along with the images of tree trunks in image 10…
I cannot see anything in that area, other than trees,
that can fill all those references.
AP

Or the solution to Alchemist dar….

Yes klbt, i did think the stories of mitchell refered to her house in atlanta. i also thought i had a pretty good solve for V1/P2 pairing being at the four corners monument. then the tie in to Herman Park was made, the outline of Charleston was discovered and my theory crashed and burned. i love the new ideas that come out daily. i have never, since latitude longitude_ birth month tie ins_ and city confirmers, even thought about them as anything else. lets stop the bickering, focus on the ‘unknowns’ and find another casque.

please animal painter check out the lion bridge!  the “proud” could be “pride” , like pride of lions,ok?
please!

KLBT, I have not once discounted any ideas that you may have and if you have felt this way…I am honestly sorry.  I dont know how to put this any other way but what upsets me is rehashed discussions on city confirmers; lat/long numbers; and birthmonth stones, flowers & month numbers.  I dont think it is just me on these boards that thinks that these aspects in the I’s are definite.  By all means, throw out ideas (previously brought up or new to the boards).  I  have no problem with that.  Heck, I am about ready to toss out my 4 Corners Monument ideas again {well, maybe not…the map on the Lions head sure looks like Charleston to me….but not definitive until the casque is dug up}.  I would love to see your maps of Niagra Falls matching this SheCrab.
Again, I am sorry if I have come across as closed minded to new ideas.  A brand new poster just put on a very convincing theory that goes against Boogie’s NY V and Blight’s Roanoke I and I am all opened to investigating it.  As I have said in the past on several occasions, I just want this 20+ year old hunt solved.  I dont think anything I have put up is contrary to me wanting casques found.
KLBT, you said “Trohn, Blight, and Fox: I do not WANT to find a treasure.  I want everyone else to find them.”  I am really not sure where this came from and I have never thought that you were out on your own looking for these.  I know that you are freely sharing your ideas.  That is why I love the people on this board working on this hunt.  Your mom knows all about the boards at 12 while working on ATT.  I experienced the secretive tactics and backstabbing firsthand there. That was a whole different ballgame.
Lastly, I do apologize for coming off closed minded.  I never intended on that.  You know how difficult it is to try to glean a person’s intent or mindset through typed words.  Lets find another casque guys

fox

KLBT, I have not once discounted any ideas that you may have and if you have felt this way…I am honestly sorry.  I dont know how to put this any other way but what upsets me is rehashed discussions on city confirmers; lat/long numbers; and birthmonth stones, flowers & month numbers.  I dont think it is just me on these boards that thinks that these aspects in the I’s are definite.  By all means, throw out ideas (previously brought up or new to the boards).  I  have no problem with that.  Heck, I am about ready to toss out my 4 Corners Monument ideas again {well, maybe not…the map on the Lions head sure looks like Charleston to me….but not definitive until the casque is dug up}.  I would love to see your maps of Niagra Falls matching this SheCrab.
Again, I am sorry if I have come across as closed minded to new ideas.  A brand new poster just put on a very convincing theory that goes against Boogie’s NY V and Blight’s Roanoke I and I am all opened to investigating it.  As I have said in the past on several occasions, I just want this 20+ year old hunt solved.  I dont think anything I have put up is contrary to me wanting casques found.
KLBT, you said “Trohn, Blight, and Fox: I do not WANT to find a treasure.  I want everyone else to find them.”  I am really not sure where this came from and I have never thought that you were out on your own looking for these.  I know that you are freely sharing your ideas.  That is why I love the people on this board working on this hunt.  Your mom knows all about the boards at 12 while working on ATT.  I experienced the secretive tactics and backstabbing firsthand there. That was a whole different ballgame.
Lastly, I do apologize for coming off closed minded.  I never intended on that.  You know how difficult it is to try to glean a person’s intent or mindset through typed words.  Lets find another casque guys

Fox, how does it feel to be smited?
Welcome to the club!
My last word on this (I feel like I can not get my ideas across so that someone will take
me seriously so that I can feel the warmth of team-work and companionship) topic:
Its been going on for over twenty-six years.  WE ALL SUCK.  BYRON WINS.
Now lets dig (dirt, not each other).

i have learned from the smite himself how to turn the other cheek mr trohn and am honored to be the first inductee into your club.

oops, should have said smite MASTER himself. my brain was working faster than my fingers.

Unknown

Unknown:
“…does anyone on this board know for sure which meaning each of these double entendre’s represents?”

‘fraid not. But in general I try to imagine non-obvious meanings. These
are
riddles, after all. For example,
“Cast in copper”
may not refer to a copper statue, but rather to a pool where one might toss in pennies. Who knows?
On the other hand, it is difficult to imagine how
“Pass the compass and reach / The foot of the culvert”
could mean anything other than the obvious.

Just an observation: There are so many double entendre’s in verse 8, including “stories,” “beating,” “nature,” “compass,” and “letter,” that it is extremely difficult to devine the intended meaning.  That of course is the point, but does anyone on this board know for sure which meaning each of these double entendre’s represents?  With a definative meaning, it might be easier to solve the the riddle and locate the casque. Note that I said MIGHT be easier!

It wasn’t just that it was flat, it was also behind a large-ish something, and is right next to LMD.  Also, it’s approximately 100 average-step paces from the underside of a bridge.  Granted, that bush may not have been quite as large back then, but it is big enough to suggest that it’s been there awhile.

Slappy,
I will surely check “at their southern feet”.
Yesterday, I was able to go and check on the
thawing status of the ground at Lake Park.
It was 25 degrees, and the surface had frozen again.
(Moving toward Spring in Milwaukee is like
“taking two steps forward and
three
steps back…”)
I did learn an interesting and possibly important fact.
P Kupper designed
two
different lion sculptures.
At each end of each bridge, there are two distinct lions.
One faces to the left and one faces to the right.
The woman in image 10 is facing to the right.
If she signifies a particular lion. then BP chose the lion on the East.
If not, then JPP chose the lion whose face he liked better to
paint in image 10.
AP

KLBT,
Your last message came in just as I was leaving for work.
I did take some better photos of the area at Ravine Rd.,
but will not be able to put them up on webshots until
later this evening.
AP

I find this fascinating:
It may not be a locust after all….(don’t laugh at my quasi-photo-shop skills, which are nonexistent at best. I think you get the idea.)

Shecrab,
I like the way you think!
AP

Thanks!!

KLBT,
Here is a link to a webshots album with pictures of the Ravine Rd. area.
They are in a panoramic order from left to right.
AP
http://tinyurl.com/32zaxe

Still in the land of beer and bratwurst.  Checked out building that was once the Emanuel B’ne Jeshurun at 2419 E. Kenwood.  Blank fascade no inscriptions/engravings, except the Star of David at the top.  It is now UWM’s The Helene Zelazo Center for the Performing Arts in the Peck School of the Arts.  It is directly across the street from Mitchell Hall, and I mean directly.  Walked around campus and the neighboorhood again.  Took Kenwood down through Lincoln Memorial Drive.  The Grand Stairway is closed during winter.  You can drive to the top.  Followed the path to the North Point Lighthouse.  The Lighthouse splits two ravines and you pass it when you cross the double bridge (The Lion Bridges).  You can get down into both of the ravines easily from this area.  The nearest ravine runs more south and the other ravine runs SE.  Both ravines run down hill to Lincoln Memorial Drive toward the lake.  Counting 100 paces off from under either of the Lion Bridges S to SE (and its soil and rock paths) takes you out of the wooded area to a grass lawn abuting Lincoln Memorial Drive.  Actually one of my mark offs put me into the street.  There is a good bit of erosion in this area also.  No birch trees, just as Varin had reported.  No yellow, brown, river, paper white or otherwise anything remotely looking like a birch.  No signs on any of the trees in the area either.  Although there was one at the trail head marked with a “
G
irl Scout” sign partially imbedded in the tree, so it had been there a while.  This created alot of discussion about what constituted a culvert “foot”.  I felt it was the furthest area down stream (down hill). Plus going up hill toward the trail head would move us NW, not SE.  Checked out Mitchell Domes, nice park–but I’ve given up my pet theory about this being the starting place.  The Wisconsin Institute of Torah Study is quite off the path, more north on Lake Park Drive away from the park, and again no confirmers in this area.    The way this has shaped up–The Lake Park theory works with the verse the best–but finding the casque will be extremely difficult.  This is what fits with V8,  that we have:  Mitchell Hall (three stories) , the old Emanual B’ne Jeshurun (if that is the beating of the world reference) across the street from Mitdhell Hall, The Grand Staircase (well over a mile or more away from the first two), North Point Lighthouse (compass), the ravines (culvert) and the direction they descend (SE), the Lion Bridges (beneath the bridge).  It does work.  But there is no clear confirmers and fine tuning where to dig will be a guess.  I am here one more day–anyone with any thoughts??

Unknown

Unknown:
Both ravines run down hill to Lincoln Memorial Drive toward the lake … anyone with any thoughts??

I had a thought, perhaps not worth much.
cast in copper
could be a reference to Lincoln Memorial Drive, since Lincoln was “cast in copper” more than any other subject in history – he’s on the cent. Prior to 1982, cents were 95% copper. That would put you at the base of the
92 steps
so that
ascend
makes, uh… cents.
Another thought. The treasure is buried at the southern foot of the “
G
” tree, according to the verse. Is there no way the tree with the Girl Scout sign could be the one?
Hope you’re taking pictures, stercox!
Edit
: Also, be on the lookout for things with the same design as the collar in P10.

forest_blight

I had a thought, perhaps not worth much.
cast in copper
could be a reference to Lincoln Memorial Drive, since Lincoln was “cast in copper” more than any other subject in history – he’s on the cent.

That’s pretty good.  Now, I’m new at this but don’t some of the other verses and pictures reference Lincoln or streets named Lincoln?

What I’ve come to realize is the collar design seems to be a pretty common architectual design piece on buildings in general, I’ve taken pictures of some as they pop up on our travels here.  Have been taking pictures, but going down there again today and will take more, trying to get different perspectives. I have a decent map of Lake Park also.  I’ll try to get stuff posted when I get back home.  The ravine runs down hill SE, the Girl Scout tree (not a birch) is at the very top, the bridge is near the bottom.  Maybe we need to
pass the Compass
a different way and
below the bridge
is a description of the culvert and has nothing to do with starting or being below the bridge.  I’ll check out trying to get down into the ravine on the back side of the Lighthouse today.  Also, I was thinking that maybe we don’t even need to be down in the ravine and we are to stay at the top of the ravine, the verse just says reach the culvert below the bridge, maybe giving a description of the next thing that you will pass getting to the dig site.  Will check out more of the top side today.  I think FB’s thought about Lincoln and
cast in copper
is brilliant.  The Lincoln Memorial Drive borders the park.  Even if it nevers proves to be right–still brilliant.  There are some historic photographs in the Lake Park Bistro we’re going to look at those today as well.  They have a Friends of Lake Park group and I have been on their website–we may be able to put them to work on our behalf to keep testing out theories.  Just a thought.    FB–Talk your lfriend into coming–Milwaukee is a great city, the architecture in these old neighborhoods is worth the trip. Not to mention the microbreweries.

The 200, I thought we established, was the CC-shape to part of the staircase. But I would kill to know what BP was talking about re the harpsichord.

A footnote on the
beating of the world
– The congregation with the website containing the welcome got back to me:
“Sorry — no one knows exactly where any of the services on the website originated — they have evolved over time.”

forest_blight

I am uncomfortable with the line
As you walk the beating of the world
referring to the Emanuel B’ne Jeshurun on Kenwood Blvd.

In my mind this is referring to the shoreline, as waves pound the beach.
I’m about 1000 miles from home right now and was going to stop in Milwaukee on my way back but that’s out now.  If no one finds anything I may go in a couple of months.  If anyone does do any digging make sure you put things back so they don’t ban us all together.  Is this area a place where you can dig unnoticed or do you plan on getting permission?  The thing with asking for permission is that they may say no!  Anyway, good luck!

If I am fortunate enough to have an opportunity to dig this May, I will seek permission first.
As for
beating of the world
referring to waves, that would put the verse out of order – the shore isn’t encountered until
after
we get to Lincoln Memorial Drive.

If the schedule holds as indicated above,
you guys will be extracting the ‘fourth’ casque.

Wow, you’ve got it Stercox.  I am very happy for you!
1.  If you are going to dig, you may want to get some digging help, and/or wait for the ground to get softer.  You are going to probably run into some root problems, so bring something to cut through them.  Take more than 1 shovel, in case 1 breaks.
2.  Contact the newspaper ahead of time, so no one will even think of chasing you away while there are reporters around.  If you can tell me when you are going, I will contact the guy who did my story — he may know what to do.  BTW, if you go in May, that will coincidentally be the 2-year anniversary of finding the one in Cleveland.
3.  I would love to see a shot of the 5th tree from the other side — it looks like the “foot” that sticks out is the same as the “foot” of the tree that is part of the woman’s cape.  Good job finding the collar!  You are probably right about the first tree missing — the one you found does not seem to be part of the others.  Coincidentally, I also could not figure out “birch” from the Cleveland verse (free speech, couplet, birch) — I guess those trees can die off easily.

Stercox,
Your pictures are great.  Thanks for posting them with the notes.  This is especially helpful in the ravines.  I had no idea that the footpath down into ravine 1 was so far behind the lighthouse.
My current thinking on “birch” is that it may just be “tree” executed with a little metaphor/poetic license.  Ordinarily I’m quite the literalist, but reading “birch” as “tree” seems reasonable.
Pine Birch

Just completed the virtual tour and all I can say is
HOW did you not get down on your hands and knees at the southern base of that fifth tree and dig up the ground with your bare hands??!!
I was Sir Egg’s partner in Cleveland and I must tell you walking through this masterfully done virtual tour brings me back two years ago to one of the most exciting days I can remember.  For me, the pattern on the Pabst Theater facade across from City Hall that match up with the ladies collar is so incredibly right on that it made the hair on the back of my neck stand up take notice while simultaneously battleing a strong case of goosebumps.  It is like seeing that wall at the Greek Gardens in Cleveland all over again for the first time and KNOWING that you have found the markers putting you in the right place.  Interestingly, when Sir Egg and I met with BP following the find in Cleveland, he mentioned that he was surprised it took so long for the Cleveland treasure to be found as he always felt it was one of the “easier ones to find” and one of the first that he buried.  Comparitively, I think that was very true, for once we found the wall in the center of the Greek Cultural Gardens, the “walk ten paces” part of the treasure hunt was really very minimal, aside from getting our proper bearings as to reference point for walking left to right. etc.  In Cleveland it was 7 or so steps and 10 paces over and whalah (sp?) the casque was buried just a foot and a half below the surface.  Looks like BP decided to make the directions to the actual site much more complicated by the time he got to Milwaukee and thus a much more siginificant degree of difficulty to locating the specific spot.  But kudos to you Sterecox and anyone else who has helped you, as there is little doubt that you have done it.  My advice – get back out there
TODAY
and dig til your arms are tired.  I know that just solving the puzzle seems satisfying, but it pales in comparison to actually prodding the ground with a metal pole and feeling the pole strike something foreign to the soil and then digging ever so gently so as not to shatter the translucent box and unearthing the dirt covered casque that has sat untouched for so many years.  The person who solves it should be the person who unearths it – it is a tremendous rush and the culmination of all your hard work.  A moment to remember for all time, truly.  Don’t waste this chance.  Call in sick to work.  Get to Home Depot and grab two shovels, a long metal pole for probing and a trusted friend (another perspective and an additional set of digging arms and hands are always helpful) and DIG man DIG.
Funny, when I got to the end of the virtual tour, I was confident the final shot would have been Sterecox holding the casque.  I was SO crazed to see just another nice shot of the compass and then some leaf samples.  Sterecox, PLEASE get out to that birch and find the darn thing so that everybody can live vicariously through you and feel good about all the work that has gone into solving yet another puzzle.  As a funny aside, Sir Egg just said to me on the phone that he feels like Mark McGuire and I like Sammy Sosa, both about to be passed by Barry Bonds.  Don’t know how or why he chosed to “inject” these guys names into the equation, but I think I get his reference.  It was exciting to surpass the Chicago finders (the Roger Marises in this analogy, I suppose) and be the title holders for a brief period.  But all records are made to be broken and all finds are just next in line til the next great treasure hunter comes along and lays claim to the next casque.  The heartiest of congratulations on your efforts and enjoy the ride.
Finally, as to the “birch” issue, BP was not able to recall what the reference meant when we met with him and discussed the Cleveland puzzle.  I think it far more likely that the term birch was meant generically, as it has been suggested, since it was at least twice used in differnet verses with no foundation other than the reference to trees.  And for what it is worth, an overhead view of the site, as posted in the final virtual tour slide strikes me as eerily similar to an overhead from the Cleveland Cultural Gardens site.  In both, there is a road that curves around the area in very similar fashions.  Hear it is Lincoln.  In Cleveland I believe it was MLK drive.  Two important Americans, both tragically assassinated.  I can already hear the minds of the conspiracy theorists churning.  To this end, can someone check to see if there is a Kennedy Boulevard running around the perimeter of one of the other suspected treasure sites.  Who knows, it might be worth looking into …  Then again, it might just be another “dead end.”  (please excuse the pun – I couldn’t resist).  Anyway, go get it and post some pix of your success ASAP!!!

Trohn

If the schedule holds as indicated above,
you guys will be extracting the ‘fourth’ casque.

Did I miss something?  I thought this would be the third.

I just need to schedule my dig once
the supervisor is back on site.
The date should be close to the end of April.
I don’t have a lovely virtual tour but my google
earth pin points the markers.  I also do not have the
elements of weather or erosin to deal with as the
site is well protected and supervised.
I am not down playing the great work in nailing Milwaukee
just keeping the forum updated.

I think what Trohn means is if there is a wait until May for the Milwaukee casque to be unearthed, he feels that he will have already dug up another casque between now and then.  Good luck Trohn…..and Good luck Stercox…….. cant wait to say….
4 down…8 to go!

Ooops, my post was beaten by Trohn himself
Due tell Mr. T, which site are you preparing to dig?  Which V/P pairing?

V/2
P/9.

ahhh…..
And He’s Off…….!
Good Luck Trohn.

Fays delight.
Tron

Just 1 week away from your dig!  I am very excited for all of you who are going.  Please post something as soon as you can.  I will be eagerly standing by my computer!  Good luck!  And no matter what, have a good time

Trust me, the event will be duly chronicled. It may be a few days before it gets the full FB treatment, though, since I will be very busy in Chicago for a week after the dig.
There will not be any press, by the way, at the park’s request.

forest_blight

There will not be any press, by the way, at the park’s request.

That doesnt mean that you cant take your own pix, write your own story & submit it to the local paper does it?

Heh heh. I suppose not, but the park is concerned that media exposure might spawn a rash of midnight hole-diggers in Milwaukee parks. Besides, most of those who would care already read this forum, so they will see pictures aplenty whether we succeed or fail.

When you guys dig this up, it (publicity) will all take care of itself somehow.  At the very least, we should be able to find out if someone has the authority to diclose the secret solves for this casque as well as all the others.  Good luck, and good night!

Just want to let you know, we’re all counting on you!

writing as a charter member of the “frequent digger’s club”, best of luck.
wilhouse

I wonder how the growth of the tree
is going to alter the digging location
as per the clues given were twenty years ago.
As has been documented, six inches either way
mean a lot.

Thanks for all the finger-crossing and positive energy out there from the Q4T Braintrust!  I am in Milwaukee right now, real time, using the hotel’s internet service.  I’ve already scoped out the park tonight.  That tree is bigger than I remember and looking prouder by the minute.  Dig time less than 12 hours away!!  I don’t think I’ll sleep too much tonight!!!
We will try to post something tomorrow as soon as possible. Stay tuned…….

C’mon.  It’s 1:30 here and no 10 page report with 300 pictures yet?  What’s the hold up?  Is it pouring there as it is here?

I am sure they are doing their all…..

Thanks for the good wishes, folks, but we dug and and dug (and dug) with no luck. Just roots, pop-tops, and stones. but I made three great new friends. We’ll post pictures later.

I’m not in Milwaukee, but I’m not so sure the stadium’s totally gone.
Check out the aerial views of the park on terraserver-usa.com (and maybe Globexplorer.com), and you can see the stadium shape in the lawn just South of the base of the Staircase, along the roadway.
Pine

I’m not really sure where you are looking on the map…having hard time finding both the staircase and the stadium.  If the stadium is there..could it be the 200 or……….. 200 Wells (adress) or………. roman numeral 200 CC ?
maybe the stadium doesnt even matter…but I’m quite sure the casque is somewhere in Milwaukee.

If we can narrow this down to a definite place I’ll drive up there, shovel in hand. Right now I wanna dig at the Solomon statue. I feel good about this one. Has anyone checked this site yet? Let’s get on the ball on this one so I can go!

ha, you’ll get lots of input for Lake Park, none for anywhere else except maybe the Juneau Park area.
I personally find this the hardest verse to understand, and that’s saying I just don’t understand it.  There’s a wide range of ideas going through this.  At a distance in space…at a distance in time…what does that mean?  The whole Ken Wood mixer line is practically divergent.  How does something like that fit into this?  And then there’s the Woman with harpsichord, silently playing?  WTF.
I think someone should at least get a utility probe and start ruling out some spots, especially near that Juneau Statue.  Might as well do the Leif Ericcson statue too.

I’ll see what I can do about the time and space line.
I know there’s numerous lamp posts in the city shaped like harps. May be one near a woman (statue, street, etc.).
This is the closest one to me so I figured I would really look into it.

look closely at animal painters posts.
shadowrunner and forest_blight have many good photos to consider.

Found a copy of Three Go Back, by Mitchell.  After reading a bit, nothing jumps off the page.  It’s a lot like the pilot of Lost.  Their ship breaks in half above an island, they wake up on the beach of the island of Atlantis 25,000 years ago and contend with Neaderthal inhabitants.  Ship wreck, time travel, cave men…something tells me I’m way off base here.

Deuce

I’ve always believed that the casque is buried just south of the Solomon Juneau statue given the image of Solomon on this side matches the woman in the pic. After reading your ideas about the first lines being used as a start and end I was a little skeptical but then remembered something I found earlier. From Wiki – “The property that is believed to have once been the site of Juneau’s residence is now the site of the Mitchell Building, listed on the National Register of Historic Places.”

That’s an interesting link. I’ve been trying to contact someone to look around Juneau Park for ages.
http://www.lemontiger.co.uk/images/misc … waukee.pdf
I’m not aware that anyone has ever visited the place. I’d be particularly interested in getting some photos of the area around the south end of the park which is inaccessible on Google. I suspect the area directly around Juneau himself looks a bit pristine and exposed for a dig spot. I tried emailing the Juneau Park Friends for info but no reply.

One of my contacts is having a look at this tree in front of Fiesta Garibaldi Restaurant at 821 W. Lincoln Ave. in Kosciuszko Park, Milwaukee.
It’s important that he take a close look to see if it fits the image in the illustration but also to see if it’s an Ash species of tree.  I’ve been looking closely at the verse 8 and I think it makes more sense to separate the two lines “You’ll see a letter from the country” and “Of wonderstone’s hearth”.  We are making a mistake to wrap the word “country” into “of wonderston’s hearth”.  I believe “You’ll see a letter from the country” is just saying “You’ll see a reference to an educated person from Poland”.  The phrase “a person of letters” means a person with a high degree of education.
“Of wonderstone’s hearth” involves looking up the word wonderstone and learning it comes from the word Pyrophyllite which is two Greek words, pyros and phyllos, meaning fire and leaf.  “Of fire” and “of leaves” is a riddle for the Ash tree, since ash is the result of fire and leaves are the result of a tree.  In Greek, the Goddess of the hearth is Hestia.  I think it has to do with the home, perhaps it’s chimney, or the homes in particular next to the park which are a well known style referred to as “Polish Flats”.

FB,
You were able to enjoy Milwaukee on one of its nicest days this year!
Sorry we could not have met up.
I look forward to seeing your recent photos.
AP

Well shucks Forest, that’s now twice you’ve been there and returned without a casque.  >:(

kenwood is not the ave youre looking for because youre starting at the wrong spot…you cant start at mitchell hall cause it brings you to lincoln park (at least in relation to the treasure hunt)…you get to lincoln park and start counting stairs on a kids waterslide. i released the full paths starting at both mitchell hall (leads you to lincoln park) and the wisconsin club (leads you to lake park). via different (and both correct) interpretations of the clues.

oh wait…i didnt use kenwood…i used “beat the world” “down” to send you down downer to get to lincoln park…my bad…the other one takes you down Welles ave via a War of the Worlds interpretation…to get to Lake Park

Sorry, Obi Wan…, But I like Kenwood

Just one more reason to accept Kenwood Blvd. as the explanation of the line in the verse “walk the beating of the world”….
Kenwood was the creator of this new type of electric “beater” in the 1950s.

animal painter

Just one more reason to accept Kenwood Blvd. as the explanation of the line in the verse “walk the beating of the world”….
Kenwood was the creator of this new type of electric “beater” in the 1950s.

I like that way better than the stereos, especially since the mixer company is based in the UK.

Anyone know if these were know in the US? The following ad, allegedly from 1955 is clearly from England, but it claims to have significant exports to “North America.” Of course that may not mean the US.
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/b0/81/1b/b081 … d-chef.jpg
If it was a recognizable brand here, there may be another clue in the verse that points to this as (perhaps) the double entendre interpretation. “…the beating of the world…”
The Kenwood Chef was world renown for it’s “planetary action” in their mixer. It’s something they still claim in their marketing to this day. (And is mentioned in the ad above). Planetary action mean the “beaters” revolve in one direction, while the bowl revolves in the other. For more complete mixing.
http://help2.kenwoodworld.com/system/te … ary-action
Beaters – beating? Planet – world?
Anyone feeling that one?

forest_blight

I think I’m missing a joke.

its an obscure reference to Forest Fenn and his clues and his treasure. having nothing to do with the secret

So it was published a year after the puzzles were written?

Nov 1982 for my copy.  It doesnt say theee were earlier editions.  You have a 1981 edition?
I’m not putting much weight on this but Rilke was pretty well established before this hunt.  I don’t know whether this translation was offered before this compikation of selected poems.  I own a book by Robert Hass that contains work he released prior to its publication.

Publication
BP said it took several months for the paintings alone and he had all the clues/burials/ done/written before that.
Figure in 1982 minimum 6 months to a year just for get a book to print.
So logically the book was written in 1980/81

Excerpt from a 1982 book,
The Last Evening
And night and distant rumbling; now the army’s
carrier-train was moving out, to war.
He looked up from the
harpsichord
, and as
he went on playing,
he looked across at her
almost as one might gaze into a mirror:
so deeply was her every feature filled
with his young features, which bore his pain and were
more beautiful and seductive with each sound.
Then, suddenly, the image broke apart.
She stood, as though distracted, near the window
and felt the violent
drum-beats
of her heart.
His playing stopped. From outside, a fresh wind blew.
And strangely alien on the mirror-table
stood the black
shako
with its ivory skull.
Translated by Stephen
Mitchell
Rainer Maria Rilke

erexere

It occurs to me an option for the line “silently playing” can be about letters. Letters in words may be silent in some cases. In written form they are essential, but when spoken they are audibly non-existent or “silent”. Playing with a word in such a way as removing non-essentials so that only the sound applicable letters are used might be the key role for HARPSICHORD. Let H P S I be silent. Play with the letters and form the word ORCHARD.

pls stop

Glad I wrote that note. It’s probably wrong but thinking about silent letters as part of a word game isnt the worst idea. What ideas do you have?

In the situation where you start at the Wisconsin Club and walk east on W. Wisconsin (WWI), if the verse is calling out “second” street with “at a distance in time”, are we faced with continuing on Wisconsin or are we being told to turn? Which direction, north or south? If we turn north we are going TOWARDS “Kilbourn/Plankington/Marquette”. The line “From three who lived there” might be best applied by turning south so we are going away FROM “Kilbourn/Plankington/Marquette”. Then we are heading south on 2nd and faced with dealing with the next line of verse.
If HARPSICHORD is meant to be anagrammed, then we can have SHIP + ORCHARD. If we turn east on Orchard we are going towards the shipping docks. I wonder if the word SHIP is needed to say we go away FROM the docks, meaning we turn west.

i never finished mapping full southern path, i got up to appell joyce and kinda stopped working on it after that, but you would come up past the italian renaissance adler building owned by the family that sold cars and shit. and youd think the adler building would be the stairs but they only add up to 82 or 96 depending on which mini sets at top or bottom you include…that place is pretty rad. its how you know the kenwood electronics is a correct reading btw. mapped out complete north path perfect, including the red herring path to lincoln park.

Unknown

Unknown:
92 steps is correct.

I’m shocked…
On a more serious note, and looking at the first picture, I keep asking myself why Preiss didn’t bury the Milwaukee casque here on the Grand Staircase. It has a lot of similarities to the Cultural Garden in Cleveland. To answer my own question, this is where I would have put the casque, all other things being equal. But he didn’t, and knowing that should make the rest of the puzzle (this one and the rest) a little bit easier to understand when we find ourselves questioning a final treasure ground. It doesn’t have to make sense to us, and our present day sensibilities. It just had to make sense to Preiss, and the constraints that he was under at the time.

If “from woman, with harpsichord” establishes a musical act, it could be that the woman is a singer, such as a soprano accompanied by harpsichord, or simply an opera house or place suchbas the performing arts center. The next line, “silently playing” might then follow the sense that a womans voice, normally audible, but in this case has been diminished to a point of quietude, leading to the word “hoarse”.
There is the word “horseplay”, so maybe this is an obtuse way to hint broadly at recognizing the position if the performing arts center onnthe map but also to derive some connection to a horse.

That sight is in Grant Park LOL. Seven Bridges. Great Trails and a popular hangout.
Grant Park in South Milwaukee that is…not Chicago 😉

Len,
I’ll reply to your post, but I would like to first point out that my intent is not to bash your theory and promote the one I favor. There is a lot of creativity there, and the forum could certainly use more of that (but IMO, not on this solve). More importantly, I’m not really the one you need to convince. In order to achieve success, someone has to be willing to dig in a certain spot that they, or people like us identify. Those are the people that are in the best position to comment on the relative merits of any given theory, since in most cases, they are able to follow leads directly. Having said that…
The picture that you posted of the Grand Staircase is pretty dated. The pictures of the Grand Staircase that Animal Painter posted on page 68 are more representative of what Preiss would have seen in 1981, and that staircase has exactly 92 risers. And if we count the one covered by the brick walkway, the staircase still has exactly 92 steps today. It’s a verifiable fact that no one who is on this forum and is in Milwaukee questions, even a little bit. Doesn’t make it right, but it puts a significant burden of proof on any better theory for this line. Moving on.
At the top of the stairs, we encounter our only real decision point in the whole verse, and that is, which direction do we go next? Right on the bridge over Ravine Road, straight past the lawn bowling pitches, or left, to the parking lot. The last one seems the least likely, but as it turns out, is the only one that takes us past the golf course and all those red balls in groups of two (I’m pretty sure someone has confirmed that the tee markers in Lake Park used to be red). It’s not notional at all. In fact, it couldn’t get any more exact. We also have the similarities between the lion’s and the juggler’s face, but since by that point the light house is in view, I’m not sure we need this match to advance the theory. We have the red balls right where we need them to be if we are following the verse.
On the other hand, we have a hand, or two. But the left hands don’t match at all, and there are enough differences in the right hands (recognizing that there are only so many ways that you can draw an open-palmed hand) that if Palencar was supposed to replicate the treasure ground confirmer exactly, then he missed by more than a little bit here IMO, and for no good reason that I can see. It doesn’t have the same precision that the rendering of City Hall does, which as you suggest, could just be a city confirmer and doesn’t need to be as exact as it is, and yet, Palencar got this almost exactly right. The Laureate is a reasonable match (again, not picture perfect, but close) but that’s on Kilbourn, not on Wells. As for the collar, that’s pretty exact, but the Mitchell Mansion isn’t the only place in Milwaukee where you could find this type of cinder block, is it? Is it possible that this ubiquitous building material was also found on some building between Mitchell Hall and the park, or even Mitchell Hall itself back in the day? So given a choice, I’d have to say that I’m not as convinced as you seem to be that these are clear-cut image matches that need to be reconciled.
The bottom line is that the Cleveland solve shows us that with one small piece of the image, and a few lines of verse, we have all the information we need to dig up a casque. I believe the same is true for the Milwaukee solve (in reverse; lots of verse and a little bit of image, assuming we have the right starting place). The notable exception is that I believe the treasure ground locaters are gone (multi-trunked tree and letter from the country on the PTF), and therein lies the only remaining challenge to fully resolving the puzzle and digging up the casque; finding historic evidence of where these locators once stood. So that’s what I choose to focus on, and what I am encouraging the diggers in Milwaukee to focus on as well.

Unknown

Unknown:
That’s not just a “if you squint, it almost maybe matches” kind of a thing. It’s a “Eureka! I guess any theory that starts at Mitchell Hall must be regarded as wrong,” kind of a thing. I’m not sure why Atomic’s find hasn’t made everyone shift their energy in this direction!

Unknown

Unknown:
It’s too easy for a local to say “I know – the Grand Staircase! Let me skip the whole first part of the verse, and ignore the image too.” That’s not how any of these puzzles work.

That’s exactly how I feel about the Grand Staircase. We have proven (time and time again) that it has exactly 92 steps (ascend
THE
92 steps), the verse leads logically to it and from it (IMO), one of the most prominent things in the image can be found (several times over) within 50 feet of the top, and we can be certain that what we are seeing today is almost exactly (landscaping notwithstanding) what Preiss saw in 1981. For me, it just doesn’t get any more “Eureka” than that.
Too obvious? Maybe. Not the way the puzzles work? Well, if memory serves, Sir Egbert just needed the columns, and half the verse to dig up the Cleveland casque. Methinks this was exactly the way the puzzles were designed to work, and the main reason that Preiss thought they would be solved quickly. The difficulty we are having is a direct result of time and change, and to a certain extent, the unfortunate passing of the author (and before that, his unwillingness to provide the same guidance that he showed in the early years of the hunt).

Euhirudinea

That’s exactly how I feel about the Grand Staircase. We have proven (time and time again) that it has exactly 92 steps (ascend
THE
92 steps), the verse leads logically to it and from it (IMO), one of the most prominent things in the image can be found (several times over) within 50 feet of the top…

Euhirudinea

Too obvious? Maybe. Not the way the puzzles work? Well, if memory serves, Sir Egbert just needed the columns, and half the verse to dig up the Cleveland casque. Methinks this was exactly the way the puzzles were designed to work, and the main reason that Preiss thought they would be solved quickly. The difficulty we are having is a direct result of time and change, and to a certain extent, the unfortunate passing of the author (and before that, his unwillingness to provide the same guidance that he showed in the early years of the hunt).

Can you remind me what it is from the image that can be found within 50 feet of the top of the GS? Reading through the threads, it seemed like the only matches were “notional” (like putter representing golf course). What was it that actually visually matches (as if a picture had been taken?) Let me know if I’ve missed something…
Again, I really don’t think the Lake Park theory is ridiculous. Just not nearly as certain as others think it is. One more example of why I seriously question it: I think you’re one of the folks who assumes that “cast in copper” is LMD. (Which, by the way, I agree is very logical. I think there’s a good chance “cast in copper” means LMD even if Lake Park turns out to be wrong, since LMD runs a very long way). But if you’re standing on LMD, then how do you justify discounting the bottom portion of the stairs that comes before you start counting the 92? I know the staircase has changed over the years. But all the old pictures folks have posted have shown some non-zero number of stairs *between* LMD and the start of the 92. E.g.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 709486983/
If you were supposed to be arriving at the bottom of the stairs from the grass, or some place other than LMD, then I could see some justification for ignoring that bottom set. But if you interpret the verse as arriving at the stairs from LMD, I can’t see BP citing a number of stairs that omits the bottom set. Why wouldn’t he have said “ascend the 98 stairs” or however many there are including the bottom set?
Honestly, I’m not as well versed as you on the Cleveland solution. But even there, I believe it was really the image that pinpointed a location. No line(s) of the verse would have gotten them to the right park alone. In the Boston puzzle, there’s only one part of the verse that could be interpreted in *any* way at all without understanding the rest of the puzzle: “Near those Who pass the coliseum With metal walls”. This part of the verse can be interpreted as “near a road that passes Fenway Park,” without knowing anything else about the puzzle. But that doesn’t pinpoint a location or even a park nearly well enough to be a good clue on its own.
To me, the bottom line is that images can pinpoint specific locations with must more certainty than lines of the verse, because image elements can be matched exactly (like Milwaukee City Hall, or the Spearman and Bowman statue, or the Storrow Memorial in Boston, etc.)
So let me ask you this: You know City Hall is in the image. But of course that could just be a city confirmer, not a specific area confirmer. But what about the other elements of the image? The brickwork on the Mitchell Mansion (Wisc. Club)? The Laureate statue in the hair? The bronze pattern and juggler pose from the Juneau statue? In order to believe a Lake Park theory, you either need to believe that a) those visual references don’t actually point to those things, or b) that they do, but that for some reason it doesn’t matter. Not sure which of those two views you hold, but to be logically consistent, you have to hold one of those two. Assuming it’s b), I’m wondering what explanation you might offer for why BP/JJP would include so many images that are all in the same area (along the same street even), even though the treasure is someplace else entirely – around 3 miles away? Because that’s the part that doesn’t make sense to me.

MrSeabass

You’re a HTML godsend, thanks!

Thank you, I never knew that option existed. That makes the threads a bit easier to read.
I wonder if this option should be put in the “All newcomers, PLEASE READ” thread?

Egbert

I wonder if this option should be put in the “All newcomers, PLEASE READ” thread?

No, it should be promoted that he be put on the “Friends” list to newcomers.

erexere

Can someone please verify where exactly is the entrance to the Performance Arts Center? Is it on the same side as the sculpture? I’m wondering if the sculpture had been moved since c.1980 since a news article from 1969 says the sculpture was commisioned for the entrance to the building and there was once a plaque on its base. Does anyone have evidence of what was said on that plaque?

Answering of my own question. I found another 1969 Milwaukee news article that was more descriptive of the Laureate dedication. It describes the podium as being along the riverwalk. The sculpture was probably never located at the main entrance to the Performance Arts Center as the other news piece suggested.

Four21, where does your theory lead after your theory leads to the Germania building?
Decibalnyc, you’ve laid out how simple the clues are, where does your theory eventually lead you? It would be great if you could continue explaining your ideas.
Which 92 steps are ascended?

erexere

Four21, where does your theory lead after your theory leads to the Germania building?

erexere

Decibalnyc, you’ve laid out how simple the clues are, where does your theory eventually lead you?

erexere

It would be great if you could continue explaining your ideas.

erexere

Which 92 steps are ascended?

To the Light building, to the Harp, to City Hall, to Juneau, to Lincoln, to the 92 steps…
To the casque.
No explanation needed… the clues are literal and direct and lead from physical object to physical object.

erexere

Four21, where does your theory lead after your theory leads to the Germania building?
Decibalnyc, you’ve laid out how simple the clues are, where does your theory eventually lead you? It would be great if you could continue explaining your ideas.
Which 92 steps are ascended?

WHY ON EARTH would you have me explain my theory again, when you can just go back and look at it above, and WHY would I continue to explain it when you just stated you were looking for an alternate method of solving the puzzle…it makes no sense at all, you are awarded no points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
Also….Thanks for the tip Miles! I always enjoyed your sub sandwich at Suburpia!

milesstandish

Click “User Control Panel” in the upper left, then the “Friends and Foes” tab, add the username of any user whose posts you would rather not see anymore in your “Foes” list. Their posts will now be hidden from your view. I’ve found this setting to be very helpful.

Maybe we should all solve the Message Board before we try to solve The Secret

You guys are being weird and dramatic.
Working on an alternate theory doesnt mean I cant ask questions about other theories. There doesnt seem to be a lot of unity in people’s ideas. People are flip flopping at times.
For the longest time people were attached to Mitchell Hall on Kenwood and tied that to Lake Park, nearest in the distance and its Grand Stair. Now (some) people are anchored at the Wisconsin Club on Wells/Wisconsin, poke around Pere Marquette a bit, then follow the blue ribbon eastbound towards Lincoln and poke around Juneau Park, then what, back to Lake Park?

So four21’s answer to the casque location is hard to understand. After Juneau and Lincoln he says “to the 92 steps…” and no explanation needed.
Mr. Seabass’ answer is go to Pere Marquette which has bridges and culverts all over the place, but thats just the beginning and not the ending spot…
Decibalnyc’s answer (when four21’s not answering for him) is “look at my explanation in the previous posts”, and thinking I missed it, I couldnt find it after review.

decibalnyc

Lets start here…. YOU don’t see a necessity for the connection because you don’t want to, nor do you have any clue as to how these puzzles work. The book says that you might be able to find the locations FROM YOUR HOME…in 1981 without the internet. Maybe you would have a set of encyclopedias, and a common knowledge of pop culture and us history. Maybe if you were an EXTREMELY well read person you MIGHT stumble onto some of these literary references, but BP made it so it wasn’t necessary to know this stuff in order to find a casque. He used simple puzzles and clues that ANYONE would be able to figure out using only the book and some common sense.

Rather than saying I have no clue how these puzzles work, how about understanding that I am choosing an alternate approach to their solutions? I’m making a concious effort to avoid a random scavenger hunt style solution. If the first line places us in view of the three stories of Mitchell that is the Wisconsin Club, then I suspect there’s some reasoning behind that. It may be only that it’s BP’s way of promoting the governing focus on Germany, but that might not be all there is to it. I want to investigate a bit further and see if there’s any consistency to something which may be hiding beneath the surface of that choice. Could be a link to the builder of the Mitchell Mansion, or that the Pabst Theater was the original location for the Deutscher Club. That sort of thinking promotes the fluid and intelligent kind of treasure hunt I think we’re up against.

Until the folks who think the puzzle is easy find a casque or as long as they continue to put all their faith in birch trees that no longer exist, I’ll continue to respect the challenge this puzzle presents.
I can accept that a few of these puzzles are much easier or require much less focus on their verse. Chicago’s finders did a great job tackling things, found the corner Grant Park over L’s shoulder and the ten by thirteen. They fumbled a bit and for reasons unclear they needed help from BP to recover the casque. Cleveland’s finders also did a great job, but as simple as the brick counting seemed to be, there was still some difficulty. (BTW, thanks Egbert for sharing more pics of the dig and answering questions). Now we have this Milwaukee puzzle, a pretty good little rebus and some strong visuals, along with a verse that sounds like quite a trek.
I’ve been puzzling over a very slight set of references that involves piecing together mere bits as they appear loosely in the verse. I’m considering a connection to playing cards. I have scant to go on, and this may seem as fucking stupid as my recent interlude into football, as if the logo of the Green Bay Packers (Big Letter “G”) could be a letter from the country, and despite the use of the word ‘foot’ in the verse and the tiny red balls (or four21’s nuts if you prefer) in the image. I suppose we’d have have a different view if the balls were green…
So cards,
1st line solves as the site of the Wisconsin Club. A club may be a walking stick (i’m thinking of the Irish thing), and also a suit in cards.
2nd line uses the word beating. Perhaps another reference to a club, the verb means “to beat”. Also, I like that a heart, something which may also be beating, is another suit in cards.
14th line uses the word bridge. Bridge is a type of card game. Oxford Dictionary says the name of the card game, Bridge is the English pronounciation originating from the Russian Whist game called “Biritch”.
17th line uses the word birch. Perhaps this supports a veiled set of connections to Biritch/Whist.
Definitions of the word ‘whist’ include “to become silent”.
17th line, “silently playing”, seems reasonable as a reference to Whist.
This card game idea seems beyond the fringe, but when I take a closer look at the line “from woman, with harpsichord” I noticed an almost impossible anagram that works for where I’m stuck in my previous narrative where I’ve taken south 2nd street into the Clock Tower Acres neighborhood. While I was cross referencing the street names with the word harpsichord, I noticed ORCHARD street could be spelled from the same letters with the letters HPSI leftover. If I include the rest second part of the line WITH HARPSICHORD, I can form the anagram ORCHARD WHIST HIP.
It looks awkward and bulky to take
“From woman, with harpsichord” and derive “From woman, HIP/ORCHARD/WHIST” as an indicator for “turn onto Orchard street”. I don’t see how the letters HIP fit into it unless they’re just leftover after BP puzzled out what he wanted to do with the words WHIST and ORCHARD. The word HIP doesn’t seem specific to gender. The alternative PHI, a greek letter, doesn’t either.
So that’s as far as my thought experiment for the day. I hate anagrams.
E: hey, maybe someone local can help determine if Orchard street going west from 2nd street went through in 1982. I’m not sure how/when the construction of the North-South freeway interrupted the minor streets. Currently, Orchard is cut off from continuous travel, so it seems odd that BP wouldn’t just pick a major street if his intent was to turn west from 2nd.

erexere

… and the tiny red balls (or four21’s nuts if you prefer) in the image.

Yes, I prefer deez nuts, tiny as they may be… Keep jugglin’ ’em.

Jumping ahead to the Kosciuzko Park idea that I had long ago, I always liked the idea that his being a 1-star general could potentially be the intent for “proud tall fifth”. I have an improvement, actually a revision.
You’ll see a letter from the country
also,
Cast in copper
I think this brings attention to something as it relates to stamps and coins.
The year 1792 was when the US Stamp Act and the US Coinage Acts were passed. Some of the first minted coins are known as “birch pennies”. This could be a reason BP looks for a young birch tree. Perhaps his thinking was to guide us to the conclusion that the “proud tall fifth” is worth 5-cents. It just so happens that Thaddeus Kosciuzko was featured on the 1933 5-cent stamp.

The main question that needs an answer is – How do I know this is the right spot? Which is information that should be able to be obtained without a shovel.

It’s probably under one of those pokemon’s…they are all over lake park.

Of the three founders of Milwaukee, I wonder if the dwarves were more invested in George Walker because he was a surveyor.

Yes, the book explicitly says the dwarves hid their “imperial star” (purple amethyst).
Words in the verse such as “walk” and “compass” could be suggesting Walker and Point.

erexere

Yes, the book explicitly says the dwarves hid their “imperial star” (purple amethyst).

however the author explicitly said you only need the verse and the image. Therefore the idea/concept/viewpoint of a dwarf will specifically have no bearing or effect on the hunt.

Since I have a strong opinion that “beating of the world” has to do with recognizing Wells street by way of H.G. Wells, I wanted to know whom the street was really named after. I read about Captain William Wells, a U.S. soldier who helped in communications with the Native Americans. He lost his life trying to protect the wagons filled with women and children being escorded away from Fort Dearborn in a 15 minute massacre by a Native attack on August 15th, 1812.

Aren’t there german things/beer gardens in some of these parks? Why would a Girl Scout symbol in any way resemble a “letter from ” I always expected this one to be passing a sign with an esset or umlauts.

The girl scout markers had a GS on them.
G is a letter from Germany.

I… think that’s more than a little bit tenuous, but alright. Especially since they said “GS” and not just “G.” I’d be shocked if this clue wasn’t referring to something a bit more obvious than the letter G next to the S (but ignore the S!)

I just now realized the “beating of the world” doesnt need to to be first thought of as WWII and then fooled with like a missing letters guessing game.
The cleanest way to deal with it is to envision Byron standing on Wells street in view of the Mitchell House. Wells = H.G.Wells = War of the Worlds = “beating of the world”. Its just that simple and its not necessary to think in terms of WWII.
Im sticking with the Wells theme for Time Travel. Ticking time…a measurement of degrees on a circle. Travelling…a measure of distance.

decibalnyc

The girl scout markers had a GS on them.
G is a letter from Germany.

D is from Deutschland.

This is what the Girl Scout marker looks like.
It has enough letters for almost any “country”.

catherwood

I’m ready to drink a fifth of whiskey while dressed like James Monroe wearing a giant letter E on my head, if it would help.

I’d like a fifth of WISH KEY. *flips a penny into a wishing well*

That’s an absolutely awful match. There is almost no way in hades that refers to “a letter from wunderstone’s hearth.” I always assumed there was a big stylized GS or something on there.
Has this really been the basis for multiple theories/digs? I’m sorry if i seem rude, but this might be the worst case of “desperately wanting our theory to be right” I’ve seen. There is no possible way that marker fits the clue as written.

Xieish

That’s an absolutely awful match. There is almost no way in hades that refers to “a letter from wunderstone’s hearth.” I always assumed there was a big stylized GS or something on there.
Has this really been the basis for multiple theories/digs? I’m sorry if i seem rude, but this might be the worst case of “desperately wanting our theory to be right” I’ve seen. There is no possible way that marker fits the clue as written.

You’re right…I would probably just stay away from Lake Park, and dissuade anyone else from looking there.

I never said any of those words, so I’m not sure what I’m right about.
You’re an intelligent person. It’s entirely possible that the solution is in Lake Park but those markers have nothing to do with it. It’s also possible that it’s not in lake park, but
either way
those girl scout markers are not involved in this puzzle. If that’s the best we can do for any of the clues then what’s the point of this hunt? If the clues aren’t solvable then why are we here? If that is the “letter from wunderstone’s hearth” what’s the point of solving any of the clues, if they could all wind up being completely unrelated markers with tons of non-unique letters on them?
At that point a sign that says “LAKE PARK” or “HELLO” would be equally valid. L is a letter in german, so is H.

If they appeared on a proud tall fifth…Yes…any letters would be pertinent.

Sure, if we had it all solved and were left with the obvious “huh, I guess these HAD to be the markers, what a bad clue!” But we’re not. If you threw out everything we “knew” about these hunts and someone came to this board with that image and said “letter from wunderstone’s hearth” we would all politely thank them for their time and disregard it.
Nobody would be convinced by that image who was not already convinced of the theory it is shoehorned to fit. Can you really believe that marker means “a letter from wunderstone’s hearth” objectively? I can’t fathom it, knowing what we know about the rest of the clues. They’re fairly obvious and make sense. “M and B” does not refer to a sign that say “Make way for Beautiful sunshine!” The clues are at least a little specific. Why even have that clue? The GSA have tons of history, is a reference to Germany really the best way to bring attention to that marker? Would anyone walking around in 1982 see that marker and go “Ah yes, this is a letter from Wunderstones hearth”? I just can’t believe it.
I gain nothing from being contrary, as I’m not in Milwaukee and likely never will be, but someone needs to call this out, that is an
awful
match to the clue. This is my first time actually seeing the marker in question.
It doesn’t mean Lake Park is wrong
but proceeding like THIS is the only thing that can be the answer to that line is… well it seems ridiculous to me and so unlike the rest of the work applied to this & other puzzles. It’s inconsistent with the absolutely excellent work we’ve seen done on these puzzles.

A tree with a metal marker of any kind on it mi ghostt be considered like a “medal of honor” to the Dwarven Fair Folk. Thats the only way I can see the word ‘proud’ ascribed to a tree.

erexere

A tree with a metal marker of any kind on it mi ghostt be considered like a “medal of honor” to the Dwarven Fair Folk. Thats the only way I can see the word ‘proud’ ascribed to a tree.

See this is how you help rule these clues in or out…Erexere, that’s a great comment, much better than just saying that it’s wrong….better to discuss in a positive way.

I’d have to agree that if Preiss had been talking about one of those markers, then the fact that it contains a letter from the country of wonderstone’s hearth, is not a good clue.

Unknown

Unknown:
If that’s the best we can do for any of the clues then what’s the point of this hunt? If the clues aren’t solvable then why are we here?

With all due respect, I think we have a pretty definitive path that leads us to the end of the NLB Ravine. With the exception of one clue (“after climbing the grand 200”), most of the rest of the verse leads us unequivocally to there. I mean, it can’t all be coincidence, can it? So, IMO at least, many of the clues are solvable and that’s why we are here. To shed whatever light we can on a 33 year old mystery.
The problem is that after 33 years,
some
of the clues may not be solvable (for any number of reasons). If they come in the middle of the verse, we may be able to safely skip over them as long as we have a clear understanding of what precedes, and what follows (which is why the “grand 200”, while annoying, isn’t an obstacle to finding the treasure ground). However, if the lines in question are the markers to the exact plot of land where we are supposed to dig, well then, the odds of digging up the casque decrease significantly. If you don’t like the odds, then perhaps this isn’t the place for you. But please, be a little more considerate to those of us who embrace the challenge and keep looking for ways to increase those odds in our favor.
Trees and girls scout markers are the best we’ve got right now. It might be the best we’ll ever get. But I’m convinced that we are in the right place, and if the protocols for this verse are consistent, then we are within a few hundred feet of the treasure ground.
As always, my two cents.

Unknown

Unknown:
I’d have to agree that if Preiss had been talking about one of those markers, then the fact that it contains a letter from the country of wonderstone’s hearth, is not a good clue.

Would you agree that the puzzle (as a whole) has it’s share of “bad clues” ? And if so, is it possible that some of the clues were bad from the jump, and not just because time and change has made them bad?
Answering my own question, I think the “after climbing the grand 200” was a bad clue from inception. On the other hand, “the first young birch” and “the letter of wonderstone’s hearth” might be examples of clues that made perfect sense in 1982, but just doesn’t fit the treasure ground today. A better example might be “the end of 10 X 13” in Chicago. It might have lead precisely to the casque in 1983 (although, it is well documented that even with that, the finders still needed help and confirmation from Preiss), but today, anyone in that corner of Grant Park is left scratching their head on what exactly Preiss meant by “10 X 13”. Doesn’t mean you abandon all the other clues. It just means you find something (maybe a historical picture or document) that might shed a little light on the clue.
For me, I’ll switch gears on this one when someone shows me something better for the verse as a whole, not just a line here or there.

Euhirudinea

For me, I’ll switch gears on this one when someone shows me something better for the verse as a whole, not just a line here or there.

I have to agree, the verse works up to the birch…then you are only 2 directions away from a potential dig spot.

Nobody said anything about switching gears or the theory being false. I’m sorry to call him out but decibalnyc made that up and attributed it to me. Why are we now discussing that like it was ever on the table?
However, just because the clue may be “dead” and unsolvable in 2014 doesn’t mean I need to accept that Girl Scout marker in any way shape, or form as a “replacement” clue. I agree
100%
that there are clues that no longer exist. I do not think that the Girl Scout marker somehow makes up for that, nor do i think the GS marker
not
being the “letter from wunderstone’s hearth” means that Lake Park/the whole theory is bunk. I literally never said that.

I’ve often went wrong by my own persistence to treat the puzzle in the way I hope it works, rather than how it actually works. It’s a tough line when drawing conclusions formed by an unknown mix playful references that are sometimes literal and exact and at other times once or twice removed by a layer of implication.
There was a time some of us treated the verse like it wasn’t linear…that only made us cringe at the unfathomable possibilities and futility of the notion. I’ve thought the juggler was symbolic for juggling the verse lines, thus opening this puzzle to such a nonlinear idea. It’s always possible, but I think we would agree that it needs to be justifiable at the inset.
A juggler with seven objects could mean a lot of things. How we treat symbolism in the images, whether it’s just a rebus or some connection to the month of a birthstone will continue to be a factor. Until we find another casque, I hesitate to ignore such possibilities.

Unknown

Unknown:
The cleanest way to deal with it is to envision Byron standing on Wells street in view of the Mitchell House. Wells = H.G.Wells = War of the Worlds = “beating of the world”. Its just that simple and its not necessary to think in terms of WWII

Unknown

Unknown:
Im sticking with the Wells theme for Time Travel. Ticking time…a measurement of degrees on a circle. Travelling…a measure of distance.

I honestly don’t think this is part of the solution, but as a starting point, it actually makes sense. In the abstract, it’s on the same level as Mitchell Hall on Kenwood. I’m with you so far.
And you’ve lost me.
All I can say is that if these puzzles follow this degree of complexity, and I should note that the two that have been solved did not, then there is no hope. For me at least. “Three stories” is a building, “nature” is a park, “copper” is a Lincoln Penny, and “steps” is a staircase. Like that.

I saw something somewhere…not sure what I was watching…I think it was a ship captain using a tool to plot a course on a map. It looked like a compass. If I understand it correctly, he measured the distance traveled in one day and then “walked” the tool across the map some number of times to show how much distance would be traveled in some number of days. I think this is the idea behind using a map of Milwaukee.
I’m trying to replicate this with an online tool, but It’s clumsy. I wish I had an actual map of Milwaukee…then I’d just do this by hand and feel good about it.

Unknown

Unknown:
nor do i think the GS marker not being the “letter from wunderstone’s hearth” means that Lake Park/the whole theory is bunk. I literally never said that.

Ok, so you like the theory up until we get to the “first young birch” but not so much from there (including absolute disdain for the GS Medallion connection), correct? Without putting words into anyone else’s mouth, and allowing for differences of opinion on how exactly the trail markers figured into the end game, I think that’s the consensus. But we have to consider that back in 1981, when the trail was new and freshly marked, those medallions would have been hard to miss. Being highly visible is kind of the point, after all.

Check this out,
Find the unique spot on the city map where you view City Hall. Mark it down on a map. Point A.
Find Plankington at 200 Grand. Mark it down. Point B.
Relate these to the solar system. Point A is the Sun. Point B, having to do with following the Wells street to a Wishing Well with HG Wells references of The War of the Worlds to The Time Machine and then consider that HG is a mercury reference, Hg, but also the first planet. Use Points A to B as that unit distance reference on the map.
Walk the compass seven steps.

“Step on nature”. Literally.
http://tinyurl.com/qjtyd2x

That’s not exactly literally. This isn’t an argument, but if “Nature” was written on the ground I’d agree with your literally.

Unknown

Unknown:
if “Nature” was written

Blah, blah…
blah blah blah.
Somewhere in a dusty old cardboard box, there is a polaroid of this sign. Preiss wasn’t being poetic when he wrote the clue “step on nature”. He was being literal.*
*The usual disclaimers about these being my words and my thoughts (original or adopted) apply. Proceed accordingly.

Euhirudinea

“Step on nature”. Literally.
http://tinyurl.com/qjtyd2x

I’m not saying this is what BP intended because the date and placement of the sign isn’t verified, but this is as literal as it gets for me. Additionally, how about this for a literal interpretation of “wonderstones hearth” with a German connection (which also likely has no connection, but the date is good):
http://www.loc.gov/item/ncr000922/
. See the red ball? LOL.

Hi four21!
Such a lovely hearth…! And so warm and cozy.
Winter is coming early to Wisconsin with morning temps in the 30s already.
But we will keep looking until we find the casque…or the snow covers the ground.
AP

Unknown

Unknown:
I’m not saying this is what BP intended because the date and placement of the sign isn’t verified

Very true. I was just having a little fun. But if the sign was there in 1981…

Euhirudinea

Very true. I was just having a little fun. But if the sign was there in 1981…

… Then we’d be exactly in the same spot we are now?

Unknown

Unknown:
Winter is coming early to Wisconsin with morning temps in the 30s already

As it has (give or take a few weeks) for at least the last 33 years. All the more reason to think that the northern casques were already in the ground by the late summer or early fall of 1981. The 5 southern casques and the one in San Francisco, on the other hand, could have been buried any time of year.

Unknown

Unknown:
Then we’d be exactly in the same spot we are now?

Well, not exactly. We would have one more clue where Preiss’ exact meaning (or as close as we can come) was known. Please excuse my presumption, but I think there is still some value in this, even if it doesn’t lead directly to unearthing a casque.

I think the divider-instrument on a map is a good idea for how to apply the word ‘voyager’.
Another idea might be to find something relating to Leif Erikson.

The Voyager space probe was a glorified record player, silently playing in the vacuum of space. It contained a platter of copper, coated with gold, containing sounds of Earth and a variety of music samples. The first music track is Brandenburg Concerto No. 2 by Bach with harpsichord. My thoughts on this don’t really go anywhere except in terms of space and distance, Im thinking “from woman” = Venus and since Venus is the second planet from the Sun, maybe the instruction is “from 2nd street, take a voyage”.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QSgkeOwTVx8

i’m on a roll, I guess I’ll start a new thread for each verse, to organize our work.  And I might as well post the full text for reference, then begin the brainstorming in a reply.
Verse 8:
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
At a distance in space
From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
Step on nature
Cast in copper
Ascend the 92 steps
After climbing the grand 200
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young birch
Pass three, staying west
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
On a proud, tall fifth
At its southern foot
The treasure waits.

“View the three stories of Mitchell”
1) an author named Mitchell (first or last name?) with 3 stories on display somehow.
2) a 3-story high building,
-a) named the Mitchell Building, or something similar
-b) in the town of mitchell,
-c) or in Mitchell Square or Street
“Ascend the 92 steps”
Only 92 steps total?  That should be an obvious landmark.
“After climbing the grand 200”
I’m tempted to look for Grand CC or someother play on words for 200.
“You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth”
Another searchable phrase?

You seem to be all over this one Cat.  Come now, put the thinking cap on and take off the Rose colored glasses.

From various online dictionaries:
CULVERT
1. A sewer or drain crossing under a road or embankment.
2. a. The part of a road or embankment that passes over such a sewer or drain.
b. The channel or conduit for such a sewer or drain.
1. A transverse drain.
2. A conduit for a culvert.
3. A bridge over a culvert.
1. A culvert is a covered structure that conveys a flow under a road, railroad or other obstruction. Culverts are mainly used to divert stream or rainfall runoff to prevent erosion or flooding on highways.
1. A drain or channel crossing under a road, sidewalk, etc.; sewer; conduit.
…so there seem to be varying meanings. It could mean a drain under a road, the road itself, or a bridge.

Unknown

Unknown:
A candidate of a different stamp had presented
himself in the preceding year, the gallant, generous-
spirited, Thaddeus Kosciuszko. He was a Pole of an
ancient and noble family of Lithuania, and had been
educated for the profession of arms at the military
school at Warsaw, and subsequently in Prance. Dis-
appointed in a love affair with a beautiful lady of rank
with whom he had attempted to elope, he had emi-
grated to this country, and came provided with a letter
of introduction from Dr. Franklin to Washington.
” What do you seek here ? ” inquired the com-
mander-in-chief.
” To fight for American independence.”
” What can you do ? “
“Try me.”
Washington was pleased with the curt, yet compre-
hensive reply, and with his chivalrous air and spirit, and
at once received him into his family as an aide-de-
camp.* Congress shortly afterwards appointed him an
engineer, with the rank of colonel. He proved a valu-
able officer throughout the Revolution, and won an hon-
orable and lasting name in our country.
Among the regiments which had been formed in
the spring, one had been named by its officers ” The
Congress’s Own,” and another ” General Washington’s
Life Guards.” A resolve of Congress promptly ap-
peared, pronouncing those appellations improper, and
ordering that they should be discontinued. Washing-
ton’s own modesty had already administered a corrective.
In a letter to the President of Congress, he declared
that the regiments had been so named without his

Washington Irving wrote about Thaddeus Kosciuszko using the word stamp.  I think a stamp from Poland is relatable to a “letter from the country”.

You’ll see a letter from the country
To say someone is a “person of letter” is to say they have a literary or educated background.
The question is, how is this line relating to a distinguished person and from which country?
Does the following line inform us of the country or does it stand alone?
Of wonderstone’s hearth
Wonderstone = Pyrophyllite = Greek words for fire+leaf.  A hearth is related to “place of fire”, an oven perhaps?  We have both words relating to fire.  Why fire?  Something hot?  Something the color of flame, yellow-orange-red? A fire hydrant, alarm, extinguisher, etc.?  Then the translated portion of leaf could only pertain to a tree.  My instincts and observations tell me this could be a Greek restaurant (oven) near a tree and fire hydrant.
Back to an educated person (possibly of Greek origin), could be any school building or a particular person in the form of a statue.
Getting back to basics:  Image 10 shows a woman juggling, the first line describes what is a perfect fit for Mitchell Hall, a place originally set as a place for teaching future educators.  The question is should this relate to a particular woman or any person in general who has to do with education and “juggling”?  I return to a previous thought which is recognized in the abundant clues having to do with “things that turn” (a key, a millstone, the shower pattern of juggled balls is a circle, the woman’s head is turned, etc.), leading me to consider the Turner organization, which is very prevalent in Milwaukee’s history.  Another line seems to fit perfectly a reference to President Lincoln, “cast in copper”.  The Turners were close to Lincoln and represented his personal guard.  I see this as a good parallel to Washington Irving’s account in the Life of George Washington where he speaks about Kosciuszko being personally selected by George Washington as his posse, that’s right I said posse.

I just took a moment on Google street view to see that there is a fire hydrant about 10-20 paces away from the tree in front of the Mexican (architecturally stylized as Greek) restaurant at 821 W. Lincoln Ave.  I think the man of letters is Kosciuszco of Poland (Lithuania).  His statue is nearby and might be one of the markers necessary to pinpoint a specific dig spot.  I say statue, fire hydrant, and tree all work in concert.  I feel there must be a fourth point of reference.  All I can think of is the main dome spire of the nearby dome of St. Josaphat Basillica since it’s very much like the City Hall which is depicted in the background of the image.  Look and compare.  I think it will spark some good discussion.  My only other thought is it’s about lining up the tree with the restaurant and picking a spot centered between the two Greek columns but that doesn’t seem as precise…I’m still looking for a fourth point of reference.  Wouldn’t want to dig too close to the tree.

Using Mitchell Hall as a clue about education and the woman in the image 10, I have to wonder if it’s a clue about Maria Montessori.  Teaching kids to take turns, share, and be spontaneous are goals in Montesssori education.  The Montessori school borders the north edge of Kosciuszko park.

Pass the compass
I’d like to be a little more open minded about this line.  Saying it is the Northpoint lighthouse makes sense since that’s the first nearest Northpoint reference south of the Grand Stair.  But there are other Northpoint references beyond that, in fact it’s a good sized neighborhood extending beyond Lake Park towards the Downtown area including the Historic Northpoint Water Tower.  I would like to suggest that this is our exit from Lake Park line as we pass ALL Northpoint related markers and continue south/southwest.
I’m seeing a lot of options available, like metaphoric balls being juggled interchangibly.  There’s Mitchell Hall and then there’s Historic Mitchell street.  There’s Lincoln Memorial Dr. and then there’s Lincoln Ave.  There’s Lake Park and then there’s a park with a lake (Kosciuszko).  A moment in time is a “second”.  Perhaps we need to consider each reference starting with the Kenwood Blvd located Mitchell Hall has a second Mitchell related item to pair with it.  How many red balls is the woman juggling?  Two right?

You know that lion thing was a hoax…I find it interesting that the week the announcement about the lion being spotted crime went down significantly in that district (where there was a shooting about every other day.) All of a sudden the lion is real and police are mounted on bridges…but no lion poop, and no signs of it eating…and it sure is interesting that with all the parks and woods along the river that the lion would choose to hang out in the ghetto…where all the “sightings” were.

Unknown

Unknown:
American Indians had a strong influence on the Old South Side, particularly after mid-century. Three generations of Ojibwe Porters served local youth without salaries for the Ace Boxing Club since 1960. Teddy “Cyclone” Porter (pictured here about 1920) was considered the club’s visionary founder. Raised on the White Earth Reservation in Minnesota, Teddy Porter was a famed boxer during the 1920’s and 1930’s. (Courtesy of Diane Porter.)

I found this in a book on Milwaukee’s Old South Side,
I feel like there’s something worth exploring in this, but it’s terribly difficult digging into this history.

Hi,
New here, to posting actually, I have been reading the forums for a while and I am in the process of recovering the Milwaukee Cask. There are some great theories on here, great job to all of you…through everything I have read you all have been very diligent at deciphering the picture…however there are some things I think you may have overlooked. I noticed today, in the area I will be surveying with GPR (my suspected location) that some prodding holes were made, I noticed a few areas actually where even some loose dirt has been turned up…could be incidental or from animals….OR one of you has been poking around in the location where I believe it is located….right on! I intend to recover this cask, as well as any remaining casks to preserve as a museum display, in addition I will be documenting the finds on video and have a film crew standing by for the big reveal. I hear there is another person trying to do the same thing in documenting the hunt, I have hopes he will wish to team up, but if not I intend to continue on my venture. If anyone is interested in helping or joining the project, please contact me at decibalnyc at yahoo, or on here.
Good Luck

Here are my thoughts on this, it will be a few weeks before I can verify this and I will upload some pictures when I can get them off my phone. Assuming everything is correct from Stercox, Forest, and Pine etc…the first excavation, which is how I interpreted it as well. Following the ravine it puts you in the grassy area by the suspected “young birch,” also onto LMD.
I like the area and the tree that all of you went for, the G and everything seems to makes sense…Egg and the 2004 crew seemed to feel it was correct as well, you tested the theory and it wasn’t there. Then Rebus strikes out, still pretty clever. I honestly feel that area Stercox and them found may be close, but still thinking outside the box…it’s 3 miles from that location to where (if you stay on the west side of LMD) you first see the statue of Juneau who was a Leo – Lion – Pride – Proud also the 5th sign of the zodiac…so this is where I focused my investigation.
I noticed in the cape turned 90 degrees to the left, the very straight line in the center looks to me like a street lamp as it curves back around at the top, which if you stand at Juneau’s left (or southern) foot you see several of these old streetlamps which are different than any others in that area. One in particular that faces at roughly the same angle as the picture. There are a number of places BP could have hidden something here without too much hassle especially if he had someone watching him, southern foot may be as Slappy says, literal. I still have a hard time with pass 3 meaning pass 3 miles, but it would play into the Juneau statue…the bronze on the side of the statue and the hand gesture and position of the illustrations head are dead on, and with the streetlamps in that area, it was too much coincidence to avoid. Also I thought, its kind of a distance to walk, and then I think…so is it from UWM to the lake park spot….I am trying to find out about any trees that existed in the park that may have been removed since the 80’s. Perhaps 1 or 2 large trees existed in the park that would put the lamp in between them from that perspective, good for cover and would fit the angle very close to the lamp I have been looking at. I am working on getting a GPR study of the area, but if any of you would like to walk to that area and check it out, or may have already, I’d love to hear your thoughts. I have a solid week or two of work ahead of me, and I trust no one here is going to run down there and dig it up (if it’s there) before I can verify my theory so feel free to check it out, and as soon as I can transfer my photo’s I will post them up. Again, any thoughts are welcome.

Correction, I miscalculated the distance, if you walk, it’s only about a mile and a quarter…which still leaves me on the pass 3, but again…I am going on the assumption that the first dig was incorrect, which I am still not settled on. The picture matches too much with the positioning of the Juneau’s head and hand for me to rule it out as a location. Also the streetlamp feels right.
http://onmilwaukee.com/images/articles/ … 1247591294

Also, maybe this has been pointed out before but these lamps you see all over lake park are Harp Lamps, they are an instrument, but not of sound, of light…so silently playing, he could have went at night or inferred that we should go at night…here again the comma is important…from woman (Marietta St.)… With harpsichord silently playing (what piano plays silently, could he be referring to the Harp lamps in lake park being lit, meaning enter at night?) Step on Nature (enter the park) etc…
http://www.tapconet.com/images/TBR/divi … ptions.jpg

decibalnyc

Also, maybe this has been pointed out before but these lamps you see all over lake park are Harp Lamps, they are an instrument, but not of sound, of light…so silently playing, he could have went at night or inferred that we should go at night…here again the comma is important…from woman (Marietta St.)… With harpsichord silently playing (what piano plays silently, could he be referring to the Harp lamps in lake park being lit, meaning enter at night?) Step on Nature (enter the park) etc…
http://www.tapconet.com/images/TBR/divi … ptions.jpg

I like you’re creativity.
My thoughts often linger on those lines, “From woman, with harpsichord” and then “silently playing” may or may not be combined, I’m more comfortable leaving the option open for now.
I keep thinking whatever this is it has to be A) from woman, and B) something which can be with a harpsichord. It seems like a riddle. Something which would come with a harpsichord might be the bench for the person to sit and play. …I dunno…it’s tough line.

That is where my thoughts took me. In my opinion it is a riddle as any instrument that is silently playing wouldn’t be an instrument at all, so look for something else…I’ll have to take another walk and see if the harp lamps are all along the path…Woman I guess would me Marietta St. the last street before you enter the park…from woman (Marietta) with the lamps lit, enter the park and stay on LMD. All we know about Marietta St. is it was named by Shepard after a woman…I don’t know if BP would have known this history, but Marietta is surely the Woman in “from woman” and again this was brought up a long time ago, but the comma is important…separates the from woman and the Harpsichord line.

Also if this line is true, about entering at night, it might not hurt to consider Slappy’s theory of the Lion’s at the footbridge…if you go in there at night there is less chance of anyone disturbing you while digging around the bridge, or even right on LMD…or even in Juneau park…that area is dead after dark if there is nothing going on at the festival grounds. If BP were trying to hint at a nighttime search with that line then there are other things at play visually in the illustration as well. Notice the cape background is extremely dark with the light spots (as we think) being the trees and objects…again just a thought, but it seems to tie in and offer more options for a search of the area.

It is Marietta Avenue . here is a harp lamp at the entrance to the park:
http://goo.gl/maps/FelY3

wk

It is Marietta Avenue . here is a harp lamp at the entrance to the park:

I would guess, but can verify tomorrow that those lamps trace LMD and are all throughout Lake Park, but again.. have they been there since 1982?

Siskel recently posted that BP would just take a shovel and trek out at odd hours without concern for authority, so that got me thinking that maybe he put it somewhere that you need to search at night, so lets just consider that line that people have been stuck on for such a long time to be an indicator of possibly when to go…this is what opened my thoughts up to some more obvious areas that you wouldn’t necessarily need to worry about running into anyone at while digging a hole.
A lot to consider now…the park “closes” after dark, but was that a concern? What time of year did he bury it…certainly in late spring or summer when the ground is soft and the days started getting longer. There are a lot more people out at lake park in the summer when it’s warm and the days are long….it’s a city hotspot even on weekdays because of the proximity to the lake and the east side. Streetlamps light up about 8 or 9, the place starts to empty out.

A harpsichord might involve a “key” in different senses: 1) an actual key used for a keyhole on the lid that shuts and locks, or 2) the physical keys that actuate the mechanism for a hammer hitting a string to make sound.
An old type of string prior to modern metal or vinyl was made from catgut or cattle intestine. Cattle are a primary producer of milk. MILK is also something from woman.
Maybe this line of verse is just “Milk” and “Key”.

That’s great thinking outside the box, but I keep coming back to the things that BP said to Siskel and Egg about it not being too intense, he buried all of them over the course of a week, but we don’t know what research he put into it, and on what side of the burial. Did he…
A – Scout a general location for all sites
B- Bury the casques
C- Snap Pictures
D- Write the riddles
E – Book
Or did he
A – Scout a general location for all sites
B – Write the riddles
C – Bury the casques
D – Snap Pictures
E – Book
If he did the latter, then we would be following in his footsteps…however if he did the former, we would be playing into his game by following it essentially in reverse. I would suspect this is the way he intended it to be…he rents a car or takes a short flight to Milwaukee after Grant Park, finds a spot at night to bury it, by a landmark or somewhere he can mark it on a map…snap some dark pictures of City Hall and the shoreline, maybe some statues? I would guess he flew into Milwaukee from Chicago as I’ve done many times which takes you out over lake Michigan, and takes a wide turn about 4 miles out, and another wide turn at the summerfest grounds giving a nice picture of the Hoan Bridge (featured in the picture in the hair as the arch with the 2 lanes of highway below,) and right next to it are the 3 strands pointing out in a sea of blue (the Jones Island Piers) He must have took the time to reverse engineer the verses from the chosen location and I don’t know how deep he would have researched it…certainly he did SOME research to know the names of the streets and how they correspond to 3 who lived there.., or the 3 who lived there could just be the 3 Mitchells whom I think each floor is named after in Mitchell hall….BP he’s a tricky one….The lamps in lake park LOOK like a harp, or did he research the harp lamp? Wonderstones Hearth…is this simply the stone, or is it the base of a statue? Pass 3 staying west…is it a distance? Trees? Number of bridges? Number of monuments? Number of intersections with lights? The Beating of the World, how do you come up with that if you are not trying to get too deep? So the whole thing could go either way, but I feel that looking at it from the reverse point of view might open up a new avenue. Also letter from the country…is it G as was carved into the tree? Is it D for Deutschland or is it the S theory mentioned earlier in the forum? Again I tend to lean to the more simple clues like the golf tee’s, and the hand head position on the picture and the statue. Also from city hall directly east on Kilbourn puts you right at the Statue. His hotel if he stayed the night was probably downtown at the time…the Astor, or the Pfister.
I’m just trying to put myself in BP’s shoes….Sometimes the deeper you travel down the rabbit hole the more lost you get, and then sometimes eureka.

BP was a Jedi Master…thats all we need to know.

Another thing I should mention about the beating of the world…Milwaukee had a lot more foundries back in the early 80’s, perhaps there was a foundry nearby Kenwood Ave…or one that had a hammer that could be felt or heard for a mile or so near the area. There was a foundry near my school…about 7 or 8 blocks away that would shake the concrete when it was working. Not exactly a hot clue, but I’m trying to remember things from the early 80’s

What do you know about boxing rings? Im interested in learning more about the Ace Boxing Club and its locations. Im thinking “as you walk the ring” where a world champion boxer once fought.

Well not to be discouraging, but maybe BP was so over concerned about his reputation with the publisher that he sub consciously made it way harder than he thought…
We’ll have to wait and see what happens this weekend…maybe there is hope!

That article says he used a 6 foot shovel! That is a long handle capable of digging quite a deep hole.

still haven’t received my book. you guys have to go back to the grand staircase at the southern foot.  another word for proud is “grand”.
all that birch meant was “wood”. the roads …kenwood, linnwood, locust, marietta road, culvert(ravine road). seems to me you just have to walk around the grand staircase.
sure hope you all are still looking, all your research is great!
good luck!

also want to add: young could be “new” for newberry road.
if yo take her cloak as the stair casing, the jewel looks somewhere behind that, 5 feet away from curve of railing?

thanks bigmattyh
i read all of this thread and saw it wasn’t at the tree.
just thought i’d add some ideas.

slappy – if you’re right, why the reference to “pass the compass”? That takes us
away
from the staircase.

Hey Slappy — if you go back through and read the threads completely, you’ll see that some people have made great progress to figuring out where the casques are (or were).  It seems that the biggest problem in retrieving the Milwaukee casque is that there are two really convincing locations — but one might be poured over with concrete, and the other, the tree was removed.  BP was convinced these would be solved within a few months after the book’s release — he wasn’t counting on it taking 25 years.

An idea captured me today that if Preiss wanted to focus on burying the casque at the position of a statue’s boot or foot, then thinking along the lines of something relating to ballet to fit foot positioning might be a fancy approach. Envelope and Fifth are common terms on ballet.
The Juggler with her objects and balls…
…letter.
Ball + Letter = Balletter ~ ballet?

I want to fi d a link between the LotJ and this. Dwarves’ treasure: purple Amethyst, imperial star of Germany. Milwaukee might be proud of John Neumeier for being a ballet star and founding the Hamburg Ballet company in 1973..
Animal painter, you have any reclection of any Milwaukee performances of the Sugar Plum (purple amythest?) Fairy in the Nutcracker?

Anyone remember my theory of using a compass like a divider or leg-like tool designed for measuring a unit distance and walking over a map to determine a travel time or distance? Doesnt a nutcracker look just like a compass or divider?

erexere

Anyone remember my theory of using a compass like a divider or leg-like tool designed for measuring a unit distance and walking over a map to determine a travel time or distance? Doesnt a nutcracker look just like a compass or divider?

yes, but not the kind of nutcracker involved with the ballet, which looks nothing like a compass

maltedfalcon

yes, but not the kind of nutcracker involved with the ballet, which looks nothing like a compass

Of course…that crazy eyed imperial soldier with the teeth.

Here’s the same looking nutcracker our household had in the 70’s, compared to a draft compass/divider,

Unknown

Unknown:
Things considered to be wonders of the world include several statues, with the Colossus of Rhodes and the Statue of Zeus at Olympia among the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World and the Moai of Easter Island considered for inclusion in various lists of wonders of the modern world.

As you walk the beating of the world
Considering “beating” could also be “beading” as in a thread adorned with beads.  A bead could be an off reference to prayer as an object reference to some alternate significance.  I wonder if there’s a subtle hint to something like an “art walk”.  Walking along a path to observe several select points of artistry.
Something else to consider is the “of the world” section of that line with regard to the “Wonders
of the world
“.
I risk a quote from the dreaded wikipedia…
In correlation, I wonder if there’s a smart way to link well known statues and other artistic or architectural points to the Verse and Image.  I say it’s worth a shot.

Erexere,
A while ago, I found this reference to “Kenwood”…as the name of the
street we were to follow from Mitchell Hall….
This may help us to verify the starting point of the verse.
(To which “Mitchell” building was BP referring?)
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world
You pass Mitchell Hall on Kenwood Blvd.
In the past, we have thought that Kenwood, because of its stereo speakers,
may have been the “beating of the world” reference.
But I just found out that Kenwood, since 1947, has also been a kitchen appliance manufacturer…
specifically…”beaters”…or mixers. They introduced the double-beater! This makes more of the
case for Mitchell Hall on Kenwood Blvd. as our point of origin…instead of the Mitchell Mansion on Wisconsin Ave.
AP

AP, I forgot about that road name reference, thanks for the reminder.  I can easily buy that idea hook line and sinker as it really does put us on a viewable Mitchell.  Pardon my momentary reworking of that line.  It was fun while it lasted.  😀
Let me add the point that the last part of the line “of the world” might work well as an egg reference.  A type of egg that is a “world egg” is an alternate name for the Cosmic Egg.  The Kenwood beater reference works very nicely since eggs are something beaten.

Elcid, this is exactly the kind of work that will find the next casque. Nice find! However, I don’t see an issue for Oct. 31, 1976. It goes straight from Oct. 28 to Nov. 2.

Happy hunting to all in 2017…May this be the year of discovery!
AP

Is the casque buried at the southern foot of
A. a statue
B. a tree
C. a bench
D. a culvert
E. all of the above
F. none of the above
?

Update.  I’m shifting my view on this verse.  Let’s not reorganize the lines.  I thought it might be justified by the image of the juggler as a motif of “juggling” lines.  That may still be the case, but in juggling the balls stay in a pattern, they come back to where they started, they don’t necessarily get scrambled in their order.  Balls do get scrambled if the juggler means to do so, but let’s start with the assumption that the pattern is kept.  In that sense the verse is largely linear.  My only suspicion now is that some lines are “recycled”.  I think we encounter more than one Mitchell, more than one “Step on nature”, more than one “Cast in copper” and clearly we have more than one “At a distance..” and more than one “Three”.  It’s been said “Step on nature” = Oak Leaf Trail, and I’m in agreement.  I think we start near Mitchell Hall at UWM along Kenwood Blvd and then step on the Oak Leaf Trail at the northwest tip of Lake Park and follow along the Lincoln Memorial Dr. route to the Grand Staircase where we leave the Oak Leaf Trail momentarily as we ascend back into the heart of the Lake Park and resume travel along a different branch of the Oak Leaf Trail continuing south past the compass (North Point…lighthouse) and continue past the bridges and culverts and then we leave the Oak Leaf Trail again to pass the compass (North Point…Park) and reach (North Point Water Tower) Prospect Ave. (At a distance..) and continue south till we hit Wells St. (Time and Space -elements of the science fiction genre of H.G. Wells)…and then we arrive at the south side of City Hall where we continue in a south direction till we come to another Mitchell (Historic Mitchell street).  It’s in this way we will find the Milwaukee casque.
I believe I’ve found a harpsichord location in 1981…and a woman who played it, her last name happens to be Mitchell.

I’m beginning to see a pattern.   In juggling the objects recirculate.  This verse IS linear in most respects, but key lines have potential to be reused, which leads to a good explanation for how to start first at Mitchell Hall and then follow a trail south to Mitchell Street.  Step on nature and cast in copper get recycled also.
I thought Kenwood to Oak Leaf Trail (along the edge of Lincoln Memorial Dr.) To Grand Staircase and back to Oak Leaf Trail.
Then to Prospect and to Wells…and turn on Water..to the First [street] (first young = first kindergarten? Birch might be superfluous like it seems in the Cleveland solve…nobody ever placed a birch in that setting).

You can also “view the three stories of Mitchell” in West Allis by traveling down West Lincoln Ave. and looking at the Mitchell family home, which is now part of a home for the aged (but still completely intact.) it is a 3-story Queen Anne style home that The Mitchell family built and named “Meadowmere.”
More here:
http://mitchellmanorwestallis.com/retirement-communities-our-history
Just a thought.
Also, for what it’s worth, I believe the “beating of the world” refers to the World Series, which the Milwaukee Brewers ALMOST made it to in 1981, and DID compete it in 1982.

AP, that is a huge discovery, thanks for sharing.

My german is pretty bad but I recall a line from the poem Earle Koenig. Where the words ‘spiele spiel’ means something like “playful speaking”.  Perhaps ‘Silently playing’ is a german translation.  What would that be?  Stille spiele?  Hmm..maybe not.
Sorry, translating across languages is not likely.  I feel like I’m running out of ideas.
Of wonderstones hearth has my interest for the moment.  A hearth isn’t strictly a fireplace.  It is specifically the base or bottom front area of a fireplace.  Wonderstone is a reddish and “marblized” kind of mineral.  I’ve thought before that it looks a lot like the red granite used in some statue bases such as the Lief Eriksson, Immigrant Mother, Lincoln (beardless), and the Kosciuszko equestrian statue.  Maybe the line is only to say “a reddish stone base.”
But red granite isn’t wonderstone.  Wonderstone isn’t always red and is mostly lined with orange to beige and yellow.
The true name for wonderstone is greek, pyrophyllite, pyros (fire) + phyllos (leaf).  That would make wonderstone and hearth both “fire” clues within a context of stone.  The qualities of fire and stone carry the sense of temperature and color but also might be a literal chimney perhaps belonging to the country from the letter’s origin.  Or maybe its just something “reddish” and something “hard” like a red oak tree.
Of fire-leaf’s base/floor/front…

Malted, I’ve been thinking more on your question for a better reasoning on how the word ‘stamp’ might be implicated and how it would then be connected to a horse’s hoof.  I honestly can’t say for certain, but I do like the implication derived from the line “at the southern foot”.  Usage of the word foot and the fact that a stamp may be derived from a foot falling might help support my theory.  I believe this horse statue’s foot which actually points south might be visually supported by the image.  It’s hard to tell without a real up close look.  The millstone is just above eye level to the woman.  The hoof is above eye level to a viewer of the statue.  Spire’s of a building, though not the Milwaukee city hall, are viewable in the background, the Basilica of St. Josephat has two tall points, the bell tower and the dome.

So here are some of the pics I found thus far as noted in the previous post.. Note that it looks like there was a
birch
right by the picnic tables in the one picture. Not sure that helps a lot but maybe. Anyone have an idea where those picnic tables were?

BTW, with some of the trail closures and construction such as this one here for ravine road:
and the one for the first (south) lions bridge trail, the casque may get more difficult to find – if public works doesn’t dig it up.

Don’t know if this was brought up before but “stories of Mitchell could be “Billy Mitchell from WW1–“view the beating of the world” as walking through a war musuem and the time and space thing, could refer to that period in history?–just a thought thrown out

Dwarves’ treasure: purple Amethyst,
Imperial star of Germany
Milwaukee is known for it’s large set of German immigrants.
Maybe the Amethyst picture goes with this verse?

animal painter

TJ,
Is this more like what you expected?

Absolutely!
Or even rocks/stones embedded in the dirt…

Ahhh, quite intriguing.  Like it a lot.  You cant get much more quiet while playing a harpsichord than a painting.
Sounds very promising

This is a very remote possibility, but we may want to find out if that Steuben statue has always been where it is now.  I have found that city improvements (especially in St. Louis) include relocation of statues.
Mr. Steuben, where were you on the night of April 1, 1982?
Uuuhh.  Riding my horse, Your Honor.

Sorry this is so long, but i just discovered this quest and I feel like a kid with a new toy.
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
Read this using the word ‘From’ to tell you where to start, as in ‘From here, go there’. If you do that, the phrase can read like this chronologically: “From three who lived there, at a distance in time as you walk the beating of the world, view the 3 stories of Mitchell. I do not believe this is going in reverse order, it’s just reading the phrasing in a different manner than you would normally by starting at the top and reading down.
I believe the start is 900 W. Wisconsin Ave, the current address where the Alexander Mitchell Estate
http://content.mpl.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/HstoricPho/id/626
would be if it still existed. This, according to wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Mitchell
, is where Billy Mitchell (the General), his father John, and grandfather Alexander all lived (the three who lived there). The Mitchell name is all over Milwaukee, so starting where three generations of this family lived seems poetic in a way.
So, start at 900 W. Wisconsin Ave. Then, as you ‘walk the beating of the world’…
“walk the beating of the world”
Milwaukee has had 2 championships: the 1957 World Series win vs. NY Yankees, and the 1971 Milwaukee Bucks NBA championships vs Baltimore. Both had victory parades! The 1957 parade took place along Wisconsin Avenue
http://www.milwaukeehistory.net/museum/exhibits/online-exhibit/unlocking-the-vault/1957-braves-indian-text/
. I cant find anything about the Bucks 1971 parade route, but since we’re on Wisconsin already, I’ll run with it.
OK back to the beginning. Starting from three who lived there [900 W. Wisconsin] and walking West, eventually you’ll view the three stories of Mitchell [Building] as you walk the beating of the world [parade route]. (I tried to confirm using Google Maps/Street view that you can see the Mitchell building from W. Wisconsin Ave, but I can’t be 100% sure from here.)
Now, how long does it take (at a distance in time) to get from 900 W. Wisconsin to where you can see the Mitchell Bulding? Is that number significant somehow? Or is the phrasing just telling you that you have to walk a little bit (use up some time) from the start to see the building? I think the latter.
If it were me, I would then start the next phase of the journey in the same way, using ‘From’ as the starting point.
“At a distance in space from woman, with harpsichord silently playing step on nature cast in copper.” Or is it like this (see #3 below)
“At a distance in space – From woman, with harpsichord silently playing step on nature cast in copper.”
Thoughts:
1) when I read it like this, the woman doesn’t have the harpsichord silently playing,
you do
(whoa – what does that mean?)
2) step on nature cast in copper – sounds like a plaque – something bronzed in the sidewalk perhaps. Something commemorative? I see a bronze leaf in my imagination or one of those “This tree dedicated in Memory of Billy Bob’s cousin” things. I know that people think that it’s the Oak Leaf Trail, but it’s been said before, until it’s been found, nothing is off the table, right?
3) I wonder if the ‘at a distance in space’ part is telling you that from where you are, there’s some distance to get to the woman, the next starting point, kind of like the ‘distance in time’ part above told you that you have to use up time to get there ‘walk a little’. Someone mentioned in this tread some time ago the Immigrant Mother Statue in Cathedral Square Park
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigrant_Mother_%28sculpture%29
. It’s not that far from Wisconsin Ave, and this ‘distance in space’ thing could be the fudge factor in how you get there.
4,5,6) my brain hurts

Unknown

Unknown:
And the good thing is, once the spot is dug and proved wrong, we have more pertinent information.

Unfortunately, an empty hole is no longer as conclusive as it would have been when the book was first published and Preiss was involved. It is for each treasure hunter to decide if they have it right, and the casque is gone, or if they have it wrong, whether it be by a few inches, a few feet, a few yards, or a few miles. The bad news is that if you choose the latter, there is no limit to how many times you can re-work, re-think, reach a different conclusion, and dig anew. However, and this is the good news (sort of) if you choose the former, the exercise is capped at 10 trials.

i beg the diference from my research and listening to the family members of Preiss he was big on immigration and historical places like parks with history he wanted younger folks to use their imagination more get out and visit nature and historic structures that’s why the most important things to me is physicalization,visualization and imagination
the only way to get the experience is to first READ THE BOOK!!! YOU WILL UNDERSTAND THE PURPOSE OF THE FARE FOLKS …
GET OFF GOOGLE MAP ! And visit Milwaukee i was born and raise in Milwaukee and moved to Minnesota years ago and thought wow cool priess was there when i was in high school and in my life time going to or by the lake ?never thought about or heard of lake park history until watching expedition unknown
seen the light house hundred of times but the closes i’ve been to lake park is when i go to summerfest lol and got relatives and friends that live in MILW now that still don’t visit ,walk or in some cases never heard of or i should say know the history of that beautiful place and now i just want to come home to walk around lake park and other places might be fun ? ohhh and see where i think the treasure is
here is my visual thoughts : THE WOMAN IS NOT WEARING A CAPE THAT IS A BIRCH TREE ,THAT IS NOT WATER THAT IS GRASS ? what y’all think ?we can solve this if we meet at the park and see what the fair folks see that’s the only way to get that ahhh_ahh moment …
good luck to everyone …i’m still reading the book and looking for clues in the painting you do the same …

Seems like I recall an statement by Priess stating that he thought the casques would be found fairly quickly because he thought the puzzles were quite simple and direct. Don’t quote me on having the words exactly right but that was the gist of it.
Does anyone else recall him saying that in an article?

lol yes that’s what his daughters said on expedition unknown ?now over 37 years later amazingly only two have been found ,the last in 2004 it is an addicting book i wish i was more into that stuff in 1981 just basketball and girls for me, if i knew then my best friend and i would have been all over the place trying to find that jewel
!especially back then we was broke little dudes lol ? we was so gong oh we would of had shovels and about 20 fellas digging away lol wow life is good

jayheedan1

Seems like I recall an statement by Priess stating that he thought the casques would be found fairly quickly because he thought the puzzles were quite simple and direct. Don’t quote me on having the words exactly right but that was the gist of it.
Does anyone else recall him saying that in an article?

You are correct. That has been mentioned and it has also been said that all you need to solve the puzzle is the Image and the Verse.

Unknown

Unknown:
We are all wrong until we dig one up proving we’re right.

I think the puzzle construction allows for what I’ll call incremental correctness. We can’t be 100% sure we have all the Treasure Cities correct, but that would certainly be the way to bet based on the best available information. The same is true for the commonly accepted Verse/Image pairings IMO. It’s at the Park level where things get murky, and anyone who claims to know on a more specific level than that (Treasure Ground or Dig Spot) is kidding themselves until they dig it up, as Fox said.

MrBackstop

That’s what’s so cool about these puzzles, we are all right until we’re not.

I would argue that you have that completely backwards. We are all wrong until we dig one up proving we’re right. Having a theory to a location nowhere near the actual burial site does not make you right.

Euhirudinea

I think the puzzle construction allows for what I’ll call incremental correctness. We can’t be 100% sure we have all the Treasure Cities correct, but that would certainly be the way to bet based on the best available information. The same is true for the commonly accepted Verse/Image pairings IMO. It’s at the Park level where things get murky, and anyone who claims to know on a more specific level than that (Treasure Ground or Dig Spot) is kidding themselves until they dig it up, as Fox said.

Thanks renovator, exactly my point. And the good thing is, once the spot is dug and proved wrong, we have more pertinent information. I look forward to finally being able to go check a dig spot myself in a few weeks…perhaps by Labor Day weekend, now that my busy season is over. Unfortunately for me, I live closest to the two casques that have been found. Milwaukee is out for me until the renovation is over.

I’ve been thinking on a clarification for the “hearth” or home of wonderstone. Originally, it’s home would be some mineral rich spot in the earth’s soil, possibly some specific place where it was mined, or just a general kind of “miner” reference. I would suggest from the following picture that the polished version of the rock may be have it’s origin in a rock tumbler, which is why I think the line is being used to point at something relating to the Polish.

FB,
Your photos are beautiful…and are an excellent visual tour of the area.
The ravines are so sunny now!…That means that “proud tall” trees
that once lined them, are gone.
The “Girl Scout” tree by the old soccer field is also gone now.
One day, we may hear of a remarkable “find” by some park grounds-keeper…
a strange clear plastic box housing a plaster “teapot”!
Thank you for sharing your up-to-date pictures.
AP
P.S.  When you “passed the compass” in 1981, you may have been able to walk
around the lighthouse on the North side of it…leading you closer to the
North Lion Bridge Ravine…because there used to be a walkway
from the grassy area between the Lion Bridges, leading West to Wahl Ave.

TY AP ,hard to count,are the single footfalls,just as hard to count,and i think
FB said the 2 footfalls pace count,would put you across the street, i only see
that being the place,if there is a metal type culvert,at the end of the ravine,and
you start a pace count from there,i know you had a map,of the markers you
were using,but i cant seem to find it,could you post it again or lead me to it
FB nice pics TY
—————————–
and FYI,you prob know already but just in case
June 10
History Walk Through Lake Park- Southern Area
Time: 1:00 p.m.
Location: Meet at Warming House
Details: This summer the Lake Park Friends History Committee members will lead three walks
through Lake Park, a park designed by Frederick Law Olmsted in 1893. Old maps and photographs
will be used as aids to more fully interpret the park’s historical buildings, bridges and statues.
This particular walk will highlight the southern area of the park. Meet at the Lake Park Friends office
/Warming House rain or shine.
———————————–
July 8
History Walk Through Lake Park- Central Area
Time: 1:00 p.m.
Location: Meet at Warming House
Details: This summer the Lake Park Friends History Committee members will lead three walks
through Lake Park, a park designed by Frederick Law Olmsted in 1893. Old maps and photographs
will be used as aids to more fully interpret the park’s historical buildings, bridges and statues.
This particular walk will highlight the central section of the park. Meet at the Lake Park Friends
office/Warming House rain or shine.
————————–
August 12
History Walk Through Lake Park- Northern Area
Time: 1:00 p.m.
Location: Meet at Warming House
Details: This summer the Lake Park Friends History Committee members will lead three walks
through Lake Park, a park designed by Frederick Law Olmsted in 1893. Old maps and photographs
will be used as aids to more fully interpret the park’s historical buildings, bridges and statues.
This particular walk will highlight the northern area of the park. Meet at the Lake Park Friends
office/Warming House rain or shine.
http://lakeparkfriends.org/calendar.shtml#june

AP

P.S.  When you “passed the compass” in 1981, you may have been able to walk around the lighthouse on the North side of it…leading you closer to the North Lion Bridge Ravine…because there used to be a walkway from the grassy area between the Lion Bridges, leading West to Wahl Ave.

Ah! That makes the North Lion Bridge Ravine a bit more likely then.

I see the similarity.

Cw0909,
Sounds very interesting…
Wonder how old their photos will be.
AP
Not sure about the map you are referring to.
I will take a look at my earlier posts…
(Can it really have been over 6 years ago?)

cw0909,
If a pace were to mean two footsteps, that would almost double the distance covered.
When walking the trail from under the bridge in the Southeast direction, it would
be hard to measure the paces consistently, since the steps are made of irregular
sizes of stones and dirt (“rock and soil”).
AP

erexere — I’m looking hard, but not seeing any similarity. Seeing two patterns doesn’t mean they match.

Thanks for the pics Forest.

Here’s how my minds eye perceived the two patterns.  They do overlay, believe me, they do.

Isn’t it rounded?
This was the other suggestion.